We can argue about it all day long.
To me it’s very clear there is a difference.
And the ukrainian civilians indeed suffered the most.
But it’s also clear it’s mostly the ethnic Russians in the east and south.
The Banderites made as much casualties there since the coup in 2014 as there are now from the whole conflict after 2022.
Which is not surprising when their aim was to ethnically cleanse the population.
As an objective witness looking at the facts all of this is obvious.
War sucks and I feel sorry for civilian casualties from whatever side but I have been following this since long before 2014 so I am confident in my conclusions.
I am not every side since I am neutral.
Unlike Shitipedia, not even looking at that.
And duh cities get destroyed, yes it’s war.
The fighting and most of the damage is done in the east.
ukros don’t care about that since they hate them and by far most of those citizens have fled to Russia.
Can someone really be considered neutral if they believe that one side in the war tells the truth and the other side only lies?
Unlike Shitipedia, not even looking at that.
Provide your unbiased source. But to me, it’s obvious that the casualties since 2022 far exceed those from the 8 years of conflict between 2014 and 2022.
The fighting and most of the damage is done in the east.
That’s not true either. The central regions are targeted by strikes on an daily basis.
Can someone really be considered neutral if they believe that one side in the war tells the truth and the other side only lies?
That is like the typical reaction from one side when a neutral referee gives a penalty to the other team.
At some points he has to make decisions which are in favor of one or the other, that’s why he’s there.
Provide your unbiased source. But to me, it’s obvious that the casualties since 2022 far exceed those from the 8 years of conflict between 2014 and 2022
Will do when I have time.
The fighting and most of the damage is done in the east.
That’s not true either. the central regions are targeted by strikes on an daily basis.
While there can be hits anywhere, even daily, there is no comparing these strikes on specific targets to the complete villages and some cities that are totally in ruins.
There is the frontline and that is where most of the damage is done.
I'm neutral. I just think that if Russia causes any casualties, it is either by accident or because there was a legitimate military target nearby. But if Ukraine target civilians - it's on purpose.
Will do when I have time.
You either have it or not, otherwise your so-called facts based on nothing. To me thinking that the conflict after the coup in 2014 caused more casualties than a full-blow war is absolutely ridiculous.
there is no comparing these strikes on specific targets to the complete villages
This is correct. But you previously said that casualties caused by Russia are anecdotal, so I assumed you mean that outside of the west people don’t feel the war.
You understand wrong. It’s not what I ‘think’, it’s the empirical overwhelming evidence that forms an objective opinion, even if you don’t like it.
You either have it or not, otherwise your so-called facts based on nothing
The numbers after 2022 change over time since it’s still going on.
Obviously the pre-2022 was higher for a considerable time.
Maybe now the post-2022 have indeed caught up and you are right.
The reported casualties make no distinction between what side they are from and even then they vary depending on who reports them.
This is correct. But you previously said that casualties caused by Russia are anecdotal, so I assumed you mean that outside of the west people don’t feel the war.
You probably ment outside of the west east people don’t feel the war.
I never said that, again the destruction and casualties are obviously much higher closer to the frontline.
That is in the east.
And of course they would feel it in the west.
But for the 3rd time, it’s in no way comparable.
And civilian casualty numbers are very limited considering the firepower used.
I don’t see ‘refugees’ here going back on holidays to their homes (if it’s even there), unlike the ones from the west.
Even if you combine the casualties from both sides before 2022, they still wouldn’t be even a fraction of what has happened during the full-scale war, no matter which source you choose to use. I’m not even sure why you decided to mention this.
Yeah, I misspoke about the east. But define “very limited”. For example, last night, Russia hit about 20 houses. I’m not saying it was deliberate, but did you somehow calculated that fraction of casualties/firepower caused by Ukraine is higher than Russia’s? Or do you just think that all casualties caused by Russia, like the attack on Okhmatdyt children’s hospital, were accidental, while all attacks done by Ukraine, like the college one, were intentional?
Even if you combine the casualties from both sides before 2022, they still wouldn’t be even a fraction of what has happened during the full-scale war
It’s not a fraction.
15850 in total after 2022.
5600 before in Donbass alone.
An attack on a children’s hospital would be caricaturally evil.
And only 2 deaths? Sounds like that could be from air defense misfiring or downing something on the way to somewhere else.
Confirms my limited collateral dammage.
I don’t believe for one minute that would be the target.
That hospital could be gone if they wanted it, and the rest of Kiev with it.
It is nothing like the almost daily attacks on markets in Donetsk with countless more civilians killed.
There is a pattern, so no I don’t believe anything the ukros claim.
Like the ridiculous story where they blamed Russians for targeting the nuclear plant in Zaporizia.
As if they would bomb that while it was in their possession.
We can argue about it all day long.
To me it’s very clear there is a difference.
And the ukrainian civilians indeed suffered the most.
But it’s also clear it’s mostly the ethnic Russians in the east and south.
The Banderites made as much casualties there since the coup in 2014 as there are now from the whole conflict after 2022.
Which is not surprising when their aim was to ethnically cleanse the population.
As an objective witness looking at the facts all of this is obvious.
War sucks and I feel sorry for civilian casualties from whatever side but I have been following this since long before 2014 so I am confident in my conclusions.
Every side will try to convince you that all casualties of the other side were on purpose and we all short go and help the country.
Are you kidding? It’s not even close. And on top of that entire cities were destroyed, forcing citizens to leave.
I am not every side since I am neutral.
Unlike Shitipedia, not even looking at that.
And duh cities get destroyed, yes it’s war.
The fighting and most of the damage is done in the east.
ukros don’t care about that since they hate them and by far most of those citizens have fled to Russia.
Can someone really be considered neutral if they believe that one side in the war tells the truth and the other side only lies?
Provide your unbiased source. But to me, it’s obvious that the casualties since 2022 far exceed those from the 8 years of conflict between 2014 and 2022.
That’s not true either. The central regions are targeted by strikes on an daily basis.
That is like the typical reaction from one side when a neutral referee gives a penalty to the other team.
At some points he has to make decisions which are in favor of one or the other, that’s why he’s there.
Will do when I have time.
While there can be hits anywhere, even daily, there is no comparing these strikes on specific targets to the complete villages and some cities that are totally in ruins.
There is the frontline and that is where most of the damage is done.
This is how I understand what you are saying:
I'm neutral. I just think that if Russia causes any casualties, it is either by accident or because there was a legitimate military target nearby. But if Ukraine target civilians - it's on purpose.You either have it or not, otherwise your so-called facts based on nothing. To me thinking that the conflict after the coup in 2014 caused more casualties than a full-blow war is absolutely ridiculous.
This is correct. But you previously said that casualties caused by Russia are anecdotal, so I assumed you mean that outside of the west people don’t feel the war.
You understand wrong. It’s not what I ‘think’, it’s the empirical overwhelming evidence that forms an objective opinion, even if you don’t like it.
The numbers after 2022 change over time since it’s still going on.
Obviously the pre-2022 was higher for a considerable time.
Maybe now the post-2022 have indeed caught up and you are right.
The reported casualties make no distinction between what side they are from and even then they vary depending on who reports them.
This is correct. But you previously said that casualties caused by Russia are anecdotal, so I assumed you mean that outside of the west people don’t feel the war.
You probably ment outside of the
westeast people don’t feel the war.I never said that, again the destruction and casualties are obviously much higher closer to the frontline.
That is in the east.
And of course they would feel it in the west.
But for the 3rd time, it’s in no way comparable.
And civilian casualty numbers are very limited considering the firepower used.
I don’t see ‘refugees’ here going back on holidays to their homes (if it’s even there), unlike the ones from the west.
Even if you combine the casualties from both sides before 2022, they still wouldn’t be even a fraction of what has happened during the full-scale war, no matter which source you choose to use. I’m not even sure why you decided to mention this.
Yeah, I misspoke about the east. But define “very limited”. For example, last night, Russia hit about 20 houses. I’m not saying it was deliberate, but did you somehow calculated that fraction of casualties/firepower caused by Ukraine is higher than Russia’s? Or do you just think that all casualties caused by Russia, like the attack on Okhmatdyt children’s hospital, were accidental, while all attacks done by Ukraine, like the college one, were intentional?
It’s not a fraction.
15850 in total after 2022.
5600 before in Donbass alone.
An attack on a children’s hospital would be caricaturally evil.
And only 2 deaths? Sounds like that could be from air defense misfiring or downing something on the way to somewhere else.
Confirms my limited collateral dammage.
I don’t believe for one minute that would be the target.
That hospital could be gone if they wanted it, and the rest of Kiev with it.
It is nothing like the almost daily attacks on markets in Donetsk with countless more civilians killed.
There is a pattern, so no I don’t believe anything the ukros claim.
Like the ridiculous story where they blamed Russians for targeting the nuclear plant in Zaporizia.
As if they would bomb that while it was in their possession.