A former BioWare employee says that EA’s new management wasn’t on board with the developer’s inclusiveness.
Is that the game where you can have sex with an insect alien and a rock monster? Sure glad they removed a flag or people would think sex between humans was normal 🤡
developers were asked to remove a specific flag from a presentation video for “looking too much like the LGBTQIA+ flag,” in order “not to offend.”
Well, they failed. Because that offends me.
But why buy a studio known for inclusive storytelling, presumably to profit from it, and then kill the thing they’re known for? Or was this an investment in culture war?
EA bought BioWare well before this new managment (Saudis) jumped in. EA used to not care because inclusivity was just another way to sell a game, thus BioWare could be gay as fuck. Now there’s a conservative slant to it and BioWare is (even when they’re making bad games) an incredibly gay studio so this was just bound to happen.
For context for any viewers who are wondering why @thingsiplay@lemmy.ml deleted his posts, he was saying this:
- that the Pride flag has no symbolic meaning, but is “just a flag”
- that because the Pride Flag is not significant to @thingsiplay@lemmy.ml, it therefore has no meaning (which they repeated numerous times)
- that the removal of a symbol does not symbolize the removal of the thing that symbol symbolizes
- that gay people are given equal welcome in bars instead of being discriminated against
- that any change without impact on the gameplay has no meaning
- that censorship before the release of the game is not censorship and has no meaning
If you were wondering why he has so many downvotes, that is why. :)
deleted by creator
There is wrong characterization here. I’m just fed up with the bad faith argumentation. Its just a waste of time. And its clear that people don’t accept any other opinion. Have fun with your witch hunt.
Wrong characterization? I saw your bullshit before you deleted it and these things are literally what you said. God, you suck at your propaganda job
Too bad you deleted your own words, otherwise you’d have an easier time convincing people.
There is wrong characterization here.
I am merely providing the context of what you said because you are trying to skirt outside of public criticism by deleting your comments.
You made a fallacious claim that the removal of the Pride Flag had no meaning. You literally said it was “just a flag”. You literally said the removal was meaningless because it had no significance to you. You literally said that the removal of that symbol does not symbolize the removal of LGBTQIA+ rights. You literally said that gay people are equally welcome in bars. You literally said that changes that don’t impact gameplay or story have no meaning. You literally said that censorship before the release of the game was “not censorship” and that it has no meaning.
I have not misquoted you. If you feel like your own words paint you in a negative light, perhaps you shouldn’t have said them.
I’m just fed up with the bad faith argumentation.
Then why make a fallacious argument and protect it by restating it for several hours?
And its clear that people don’t accept any other opinion.
Sometimes there is a wisdom of the masses. Flags do have meaning, and their removal has meaning. You tried to argue against that point, which was misguided at best.
Have fun with your witch hunt.
This was not a witch hunt. No one accused you of saying anything you did not say. No one accused you of actions, or hunted you in any way. You just said something incorrect and refused to accept you were incorrect. Allow me to remind you that I didn’t fight you on your belief that it was an overblown issue, even though I disagree. I simply argued against your statement that it was without a qualitative meaning. The quantity was not a matter of discourse, but something you were entitled to have your own views on.
tl;dr: You weren’t mischaracterized. If you want your comments to speak for yourself, restore them from the deletion. This post will stay, though, since I do not trust you to keep them restored.
Yeah, it’s Saudi Arabia, they are Islamic and not quite as permissive as USA.
There’s no pride parade in Saudi Arabia or any Islamic state. You keep your head down and keep it to yourself or you get thrown off a roof.
Yup, white christians here in the south used to be the same until the secular and non-whites changed the law. You think the racist homophobes here at home are gone? You know sundown towns still exist? Lots of secular people in Saudi Arabia you aren’t aware of, though. Su
Did white christians from the south buy EA?
Did ‘any Islamic state’? Or just one?
At the current pace, the US will catch up soon though!
fuck ea
Of course it wasn’t. They’re owned by SA now. Used to jokingly refer to them as Evil Assholes, but they seem to want to really earn that moniker.
i mean they were bought by Saudi Arabia(96%) and that country is not too fond of LGBTQ
they arent too fond of heterosexuality either, considering the recent execution of a husband and wife for the sin of a forehead kiss.
they think forehead kisses are bad???
Married Couple from Bangladesh, He gave her a kiss on the forehead at mecca in appreciation to god for bringing them together.
Saudi Arabia declared it public indecency and executed them for it.
a whole ass execution, wtf?
also i think its stupid that is forbidden.It’s kinda weird that the US complains so much about theocracy in Iran, but is eager to do business with Saudi Arabia, which is even worse.
(Of course it has nothing to do with theocracy. It’s about oil.)
two whole ass executions.
thats even worse
Public displays of affection, yes. The Saudi Arabian government is very oppressive.
true
Can’t spell “Saudi Arabia” without “SA!”
Forehead kisses can’t get a woman pregnant and are therefore gay.
lol
The issue isn’t just about a texture or a flag—it’s the corporate censorship and what it signals. If management is already stepping in to scrub a presentation video to avoid “offending” corporate masters, it makes you wonder what kind of creative compromises are happening behind closed doors during actual game development.
it’s more than corporate censorship, it’s theocratic censorship.
This is why foreign countries shouldn’t be allowed to own companies. Worker and citizen owned companies or gtfo
“You can fuck the aliens but only if they’re straight.”
Fucking Saudi Arabian govt.
I’m not entirely sure the house of Saud really cares about western video games enough to intervene like this. I always imagined they only cared about the money and diversification from oil, “deeply held beliefs” often can be overlooked for the right price. This could just as easily be because of the corporate weathervein pointing towards conservatism, lots of companies have made decisions like this recently without meddling from the middle east.
In case this comment by @Carmakazi@piefed.social gets deleted, this is what it said:
I’m not entirely sure the house of Saud really cares about western video games enough to intervene like this. I always imagined they only cared about the money and diversification from oil, “deeply held beliefs” often can be overlooked for the right price. This could just as easily be because of the corporate weathervein pointing towards conservatism, lots of companies have made decisions like this recently without meddling from the middle east.
I’m not deleting comments because they’re poorly received. If the mods take it then I don’t see why they wouldn’t also take yours.
Good. I am just posting these because @thingsiplay@lemmy.ml removed his. I am glad you are open like this.
Saudi Arabia currently owns EA.
Yes. That doesn’t inherently mean they’re endeavoring to implement Sharia in the games EA puts out.
Why did they buy EA then? So they could NOT make games? So they could close everything down and go out of business?
Survival. They know the death of the petrostate is inevitable and that they need to diversify their investments while they still have the cash to do so. EA is just one of many, many assets their sovereign wealth fund picked up across a number of industries but leaning towards “tech” in general. From this perspective, I don’t see why they would be motivated to involve themselves more than knowing what they pull in.
Do you seriously think they did this in an effort to win some sort of Islamic cultural victory over the degenerate west? If anything they’re looking to dump it all for AI investment now, like everyone else.
Do you seriously think buying EA with Jared Kushner is a backup plan to oil? Do you really think EA has enough growth potential to offset oil?
Missing the point.
Straight answer: no.
However, as one of many diversification options it’ll likely make more money than it cost(s), ergo…
All this tells me is that you didn’t even make it through the headline
Nowhere did they mention factually that SA requested this, as much as they tried to imply it by front loading the article with their acquisition of EA and the Sims cover business.
Without some sort of public statement or leak, it’s hearsay. Them meddling is plausible, but so is management feeling pressured of their own volition, or just one manager being an ass.
You’re not too familiar with religious fanatics, are you?
But that is literally what they’re demonstrably doing.
“Okay I know ICE has been executing people publicly and it’s been on video, but that doesn’t mean immigration control in the US is getting more extreme.”
“okay I know Russian military assets are building up along the Ukranian border and they’re getting tons of aircraft ready and moving troops and armor across the country, but that doesn’t inherently mean they’re going to start something.”
“okay I know that bridge is actively in the process of crumbling and a chunk the size of a bus just crushed my car, but that doesn’t inherently mean it’s not safe to drive on”
In case the comment to which I am replying gets deleted, it said:
Yes. That doesn’t inherently mean they’re endeavoring to implement Sharia in the games EA puts out.
Are you aware of anything happening? Like, at all? Other than what you’re spoonfed by conservative talking heads, of course
It’s less of them directly interfering and more like EAs management trying to appease their new masters.
deleted by creator
Bigots’ response to the flag is really interesting. It’s like conceding that it happens but that you shouldn’t be proud of it, or celebrate it or normalise it like straight romance.
deleted by creator
Of course it doesn’t matter to you.
Congratulations for not being part of a marginalized group and for being completely ignorant to the privileges you have been arbitrarily bestowed.
Maybe you should care that other groups are being erased from society by hateful people.
deleted by creator
It is an action with considerable symbolic weight. It means EA is taking a hostile stance toward LGBTQIA+ inclusivity.
If I weren’t already boycotting them, I would start now.
Perhaps this doesn’t matter to you for a lack of empathy and care for the representation of LGBTQIA+ folks. Try being an oppressed minority group. Or, you know, having empathy for others.
Edit:
The context was @thingsiplay@lemmmy.ml saying that it does not matter to them and implying that the removal was meaningless.
deleted by creator
Removing a pride flag is most definitely anti―LGBTQIA+ freedom. Whether the gameplay loop changes doesn’t modify that truth.
deleted by creator
It might be a big deal for removing a flag, but for me it doesn’t matter.
Removing the flag is a symbolic victory for bigots. Even if the game still has queer representation, bigots still get to say, “We made you take down your flag to appease us” and that’s a big win in their eyes. Like earlier this year when Philz Coffee planned to remove all employee decor LGBT flags from their locations, but then reversed course after backlash citing, “We had no idea that symbols of support and solidarity mattered so much to an oppressed community!” They knew. They just hoped they could withdraw their support symbolically before then withdrawing their support entirely.
Agreed. They want people to see the flag and diversity in general to be seen as strange and intruding on their “normal” lives.
First they came for the Communists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Communist
deleted by creator
EDIT: This reply was a record of what was said in the deleted comments by @thingsiplay@lemmy.ml. It has been moved to a comment on the post, from this comment reply.
“What the fuck are gay and straight, we just enjoy ourselves.”
– Aliens probably
deleted by creator
The anonymous employee mentioned a specific case where the developers were asked to remove a specific flag from a presentation video for “looking too much like the LGBTQIA+ flag,” in order “not to offend.”
God what a bunch of snowflakes.
For example, The Sims 2 physical edition cover shows different Sims in several poses, including a couple kissing and an alien. In Saudi Arabia, the cover art was completely modified to feature a handful of dull-looking male Sims standing emotionless.
The covers in question:
I’m laughing hard but that’s so sad. Can’t even bring themselves to put a female on the cover.
lol like why would you even want to be in the entertainment business. Like making entertaining fun stuff? Just to make it all dull as fuck? Do you really need to buy a brand to do that? Couldn’t you just hire some devs and make your own shitty brand? Unless you were actively trying to destroy culture you don’t like…
ding ding ding! Correct.
Eh i was close
Spookily close!
Like this?
im pretty sure most games already have to do this for their release in saudi arabia. the spider-man “mod” that removed those flags was just changing the map to the saudi arabia version
Didn’t take long for Saudia Arabia to show its whole ass
It has been out the whole time. I’m not sure what people were expecting.
But the worries that lgbtq sims players expressed about this takeover are still totally unfounded right?
Sims players despite being thought of as casuals (and most definitely are) have been the canary in the coal mine for so much bullshit from EA.
They even brought back the widely hated and transparently cynical micro transactions from Sims 3 into Sims 4, get this, over 10 years after the launch of the game. These games are so indicative of so many aspects of the industry and trends and how audiences deal with changes in a way that I think a lot of people don’t realize.
Sims 1 was oozing with personality and is a pretty straightforward satire of capitalism 4 KiDz!! while 4 is not only beyond sterile but has pretty much gotten worse over 12 years especially when they reworked it into a free game. Yes I’m complaining about the themes and writing of a simulation dollhouse game mainly played by children. Children deserve good writing too
Edit: they used to call their Monopoly money “SimPoints” and now it’s called “Moolah”. Yeah. Yeah.
The base game has less content than most demos. The full game will cost you around $1400 these days.
Yet another reason why we need to move the world off of its oil dependency.
