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Cake day: April 13th, 2024

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  •   fascism
          n 1: a political theory advocating an authoritarian hierarchical
               government (as opposed to democracy or liberalism)
    

    Please point to where they are advocating for an authoritarian government.

    Hint: It’s not in the posts “As I remember London” or “Wolves, sheep, and gypsies”.

    That doesn’t sound fair does it? That’s exactly what people are doing by making these claims without critical thinking and having their minds already made up.





  • “How dare people I don’t like give away software”

    A political analysis of the founders and leadership behind every product you use must be an exhausting way to live your life.

    Unless you propose to gather all those somewhere and “deal with them”, the far-right people are still people. And if they’re not breaking the law, they should enjoy all possible social activities and the fruits of their labor etc. Basically whatever every living human would want and be deserving of.

    Your asking is unreasonable. And we all know that if the far-right people are excluded, they’ll just make a “better” Linux community elsewhere. Then the whining will be about them not letting any of the extremists far-left fury Marxists on it ever again.

    Also, this hyperbolic inflation of ad hominem “fascist” labeling just makes the word lose its meaning, and makes people lose their respect/belief in what you’re saying. If you want to have a rational discussion using critical thinking, attack the argument not the person. Define words before using them. Tell us what “fascist” means to you, and why you think it applies in this context. Then listen to what people say and try to understand their perspective before writing them off as some kind of lost cause.

    If instead you’re not interested in a debate, you’ve already made up your mind and believe there can be no other valid perspectives, well, then maybe you weren’t looking for truth OR intelligence in the first place. As a rule, strong feelings about issues do not emerge from deep understanding.



  • “How dare people I don’t like give away software”

    But seriously.

    This hyperbolic inflation of ad hominem “fascist” labeling just makes the word lose its meaning, and makes people lose their respect/belief in what you’re saying. If you want to have a rational discussion using critical thinking, attack the argument not the person. Define words before using them. Tell us what “fascist” means to you, and why you think it applies in this context. Then listen to what people say and try to understand their perspective before writing them off as some kind of lost cause.

    If instead you’re not interested in a debate, you’ve already made up your mind and believe there can be no other valid perspectives, well, then maybe you weren’t looking for truth OR intelligence in the first place. As a rule, strong feelings about issues do not emerge from deep understanding.






  • What is this even in reference to?

    DHH’s post “As I Remember London” which I inferred from this post referring to Omarchy as “fashtech” and based on other recent posts about the same thing.

    fear and hatred of strangers or foreigners

    I don’t see any fear or hatred of strangers or foreigners in the referenced post. I don’t want to explicitly link it in case that would anger the mods somehow, but it is easy to find.

    You may criticize his nationalism, immigration views, or rhetoric as exclusionary or ethnonationalist. But IMO calling him fascist requires showing more than concern about demographic change.

    Is he using “gypsy” to refer to illegal immigrants?

    I don’t know, you would have to ask him. I was just pointing out that it’s not objectively obvious as to their intent and I don’t think people are reacting fairly, rationally or even attempting to use critical thinking.

    Unfortunately social media amplifies outrage because it generates clicks, and attempting to have calm and reasonable discussions is often simply downvoted and ignored.

    In this way I find that tech-central sites with active commentary like reddit/lemmy/phoronix/etc. are quite often just as cancerous as Facebook and such. You would think a lot more technical people would be more rational but I haven’t found that to be the case the majority of the time.


  • It’s possible he is actually racist, I don’t know, but I agree with you that the word fascist is being thrown around much too easily.

    The problem I see is people don’t seem willing to have good-faith discussions or accept that other equally valid perspectives can exist.

    Out of sheer curiosity I said this to my local LLM:

    is it a waste of time to argue with people who are wrong on the internet?

    Usually, yes—if your goal is to change their mind. Internet arguments often reward winning, performance, and group approval more than honest reconsideration.
    
    It can still be worthwhile when:
    
    - Someone else might learn from the exchange.
    - The claim could cause real harm if left unchallenged.
    - The person seems curious and is engaging in good faith.
    - You can provide a concise correction with evidence and then stop.
    
    A useful rule: make one clear point, support it briefly, and watch their response. If they ignore evidence, shift the goalposts, insult you, or repeat the same claim, disengage. You don’t have to attend every argument you’re invited to.
    

  • Friendly reminder that lamenting your native country losing its identity and making you a minority is not inherently xenophobic, racist or fascist. Would you want that to happen to you?

    Not trying to defend DHH per se but I think people are twisting words around and blowing things WAY out of proportion to fit some narrative. I’ve read the posts in question and he has not actually called for any violence nor wished anyone to get hurt. He has not claimed anyone doesn’t have a right to exist. Not everyone is the best at articulating their thoughts properly, and we shouldn’t default to assume the worst possible intent. Without actually talking to the guy and getting real clarification, I’d say it’s a bit too dangerous to make such wild sweeping claims like I keep seeing.

    Or this one:

    When gypsies take over public spaces, you deport them.

    Let’s rephrase this a different way:

    “When illegal immigrants overwhelm a city, you deport them”

    How do you know that’s not all he meant? People are taking great liberties interpreting subjective terminology here.

    If you’re going to have a kneejerk reaction and act like only your opinion matters and nothing could possibly change it, well that’s not reasoned and rational debate, is it? Just downvote and move on I guess if you disagree with me.

    Also, the irony of people on lobsters hating on the guy while their own site runs on Rails, seems completely lost on them.




  • Yes I have read the stories that people always point to as their “proof”, and 1. I think everyone twists his (poorly chosen) phrasing to fit a specific narrative that is not reflective of any actual intent, and 2. I don’t believe he actually wants to hurt anyone.

    As far as I know, nobody has confronted him about these posts and gotten any clarification of his intent, they just want to crucify and not believe any other perspectives because it fuels their confirmation bias.

    The “wild comment” (according to someone) I made elsewhere about his London post:

    Of course Brits don’t want to become a minority in their home country… who would? We all know how badly they are treated

    To me, complaining about too many immigrants does not inherently imply someone is racist, xenophobic or claiming anyone doesn’t have a right to exist (the most common criticisms I see from his “proof” posts) as countries do need a healthy balance of immigration to work well… too much or too little can both be problematic for several different reasons that have nothing to do with where they came from or what they look like.

    Imagine if people called you racist simply because the community/culture you grew up around is what you’re used to and no longer what’s all around you, and you never asked for such change… of course some people won’t like it, but that doesn’t mean they dislike the people themselves, just the situation.