thats fair. i dont think any solution is going to be anything but fraught at this point. it would just be nice to leave the vindictive anchor of the south behind, even though i know thats functionally impossible and probably wouldnt really help the situation. its nice to dream of one thing making building the queer socialist solarpunk utopia of my dreams a little bit easier to achieve.
I don’t think it’s the south holding America back as much as the common American ethos that is endemic to the entire country. The south has some of the worst poverty, inequality, disenfranchisement in the country. However, all those problems are intrinsically linked to the wealthy costal elite shareholders who designed that regional suffering. They hope we waste time bickering with each other, because it distracts us from every reigning in the people who can freely move their wealth whatever they please. That have no strong attachments to any location, as the ability to freely move capital at their convenience is their biggest strength.
A breakup of America would require a lot more degradation of federal authority to be successful. Neofeudal “liberals” might use the Trump’s embarrassment of America as a way to market blue states taking more power from the fed. Only if they manage to disentangle the military and make it more regional can America properly Balkanize. Even a weak federal government will fight to keep America together, as it would instantly lose countless advantages if it allows a single state to leave.
The West Coast in the best position to become self reliant, with everywhere else either being too reliant on the federal government, too difficult to defend if they declared independence, or have a lot to gain by gaining control of the federal government. Texas would be next in line to seek independence, but with the West gone, they’d be better off working with the South to gain control of the fed and dominate the North. The Northwest is vulnerable to pressure from both the North and the South, and the North would have an uphill battle fighting a Southern controlled federal government. The Southern states or Texas might secede if the North ever gained control, but that would only happen if they lost control of the fed after failing to recapture the West.
The biggest thing to recognize about America as a nation-state is that the federal government has such an overwhelming advantage by virtue of controlling specific areas that aren’t as productive on their own. Hawaii and Alaska are reliant on the rest of the country by virtue of their isolation, and while an independent West might be able to win the hearts of Hawaii, it’s unlikely to win over Alaska based on its current politics. Alaska is an extremely powerful location for the military and would be a huge problem for any secessionist Westerners. Key military production is totally reliant on east coast manufacturing, while the productivity enabled by the Mississippi River makes it a force to be reckoned with. The only way the West could ever stand a chance is if the fed moves a lot more military manufacturing across the country, they are somehow convinced to effectively decentralize/weaken the military, AND some outside empire helps out in significant ways. It’s theoretically possible, but it would take a long time and a lot of specific outcomes to happen.
All this is to say that I’m not betting on civil war before a lot of terrible shit goes down. By the time civil war shows up, it might look more like yet another horrifying calamity than a path to a better future.
Well at least I exist in actual political reality instead of whatever fantasy theory land you think actually exists. You vote for democrats or you condone republicans winning. It’s a broken system sure, but unless you’re a fucking idiot that has no concept of civics or the political process you understand that either blue or red is gonna win and red is a lot worse than blue so unless you’re angling for blue, you’re actively working for red. Congratulations, you’re working for fascists.
And who do you think the fascists work for? Any say we might’ve had is long gone, and anything positive we do get going forward was approved by the lords before sending it to us to rubber stamp it. They will destroy our society, and given how delusional most Americans still are about our situation, they will not be stopped until the generations that believed in America are mostly dead.
The system actually does convey power to the people if we choose to wield it, but we’re too bitch ass and/or stupid on the whole to do so. If progressives voted for progressives in primaries we wouldn’t be here having this conversation.
thats fair. i dont think any solution is going to be anything but fraught at this point. it would just be nice to leave the vindictive anchor of the south behind, even though i know thats functionally impossible and probably wouldnt really help the situation. its nice to dream of one thing making building the queer socialist solarpunk utopia of my dreams a little bit easier to achieve.
I don’t think it’s the south holding America back as much as the common American ethos that is endemic to the entire country. The south has some of the worst poverty, inequality, disenfranchisement in the country. However, all those problems are intrinsically linked to the wealthy costal elite shareholders who designed that regional suffering. They hope we waste time bickering with each other, because it distracts us from every reigning in the people who can freely move their wealth whatever they please. That have no strong attachments to any location, as the ability to freely move capital at their convenience is their biggest strength.
A breakup of America would require a lot more degradation of federal authority to be successful. Neofeudal “liberals” might use the Trump’s embarrassment of America as a way to market blue states taking more power from the fed. Only if they manage to disentangle the military and make it more regional can America properly Balkanize. Even a weak federal government will fight to keep America together, as it would instantly lose countless advantages if it allows a single state to leave.
The West Coast in the best position to become self reliant, with everywhere else either being too reliant on the federal government, too difficult to defend if they declared independence, or have a lot to gain by gaining control of the federal government. Texas would be next in line to seek independence, but with the West gone, they’d be better off working with the South to gain control of the fed and dominate the North. The Northwest is vulnerable to pressure from both the North and the South, and the North would have an uphill battle fighting a Southern controlled federal government. The Southern states or Texas might secede if the North ever gained control, but that would only happen if they lost control of the fed after failing to recapture the West.
The biggest thing to recognize about America as a nation-state is that the federal government has such an overwhelming advantage by virtue of controlling specific areas that aren’t as productive on their own. Hawaii and Alaska are reliant on the rest of the country by virtue of their isolation, and while an independent West might be able to win the hearts of Hawaii, it’s unlikely to win over Alaska based on its current politics. Alaska is an extremely powerful location for the military and would be a huge problem for any secessionist Westerners. Key military production is totally reliant on east coast manufacturing, while the productivity enabled by the Mississippi River makes it a force to be reckoned with. The only way the West could ever stand a chance is if the fed moves a lot more military manufacturing across the country, they are somehow convinced to effectively decentralize/weaken the military, AND some outside empire helps out in significant ways. It’s theoretically possible, but it would take a long time and a lot of specific outcomes to happen.
All this is to say that I’m not betting on civil war before a lot of terrible shit goes down. By the time civil war shows up, it might look more like yet another horrifying calamity than a path to a better future.
“Coastal elites” is a Fox news phrase. Your colors are showing.
Your view of politics is so small that I almost feel bad for you.
Well at least I exist in actual political reality instead of whatever fantasy theory land you think actually exists. You vote for democrats or you condone republicans winning. It’s a broken system sure, but unless you’re a fucking idiot that has no concept of civics or the political process you understand that either blue or red is gonna win and red is a lot worse than blue so unless you’re angling for blue, you’re actively working for red. Congratulations, you’re working for fascists.
And who do you think the fascists work for? Any say we might’ve had is long gone, and anything positive we do get going forward was approved by the lords before sending it to us to rubber stamp it. They will destroy our society, and given how delusional most Americans still are about our situation, they will not be stopped until the generations that believed in America are mostly dead.
The system actually does convey power to the people if we choose to wield it, but we’re too bitch ass and/or stupid on the whole to do so. If progressives voted for progressives in primaries we wouldn’t be here having this conversation.