While I agree with the sentiment, I still struggle a bit with this rhetoric. When it comes to misogyny or rasicsm you wouldn’t tell someone to just try and do less of it. The meat & dairy industry is still a whole lot of abuse and exploitation, and I think everyone is probably on board with having nothing to do with it. The friction is just too high I guess.
The friction is precisely why I recommend start small. Better someone eat less meat and stick with it long term, than a full meat diet long term because they went completely meatless at once for a week or two and couldn’t handle it
Actually yes you would.
For the average person in the privileged position, “trying to do less racism” or “trying to be less misogynistic” is the crux of actioning allyship, especially when people are imprinted and socialized from a young age to be/act racist and misogynistic without knowing or understanding it.
Kids can’t necessarily control that, but trying to undo it by being less racist and less misogynistic day by day is the necessary work of anti-racism and feminism.
It also ignores that even allies almost always still hold some misoginy or racism, simply due to upbringing. True allies have to admit that we’re not done progressing.
Not only allies. There is a lot of internalization of misogyny, racism, homophobia, transphobia, etc. if you are a member of one of the affected groups but were raised in such environment.
I agree, but I think framing the goal is important.
I think the better way to go about it is to commit fully from the start. Maybe there’s some hiccups, and then you can reset and try again. I guess it’s very personal however. Some people might benefit from another mindset. Anything that gets people away from abuse, I’m all for.
When it comes to misogyny or rasicsm you wouldn’t tell someone to just try and do less of it.
Idk, these are very different things. If I think about how much I hate (some group) then I may be a racist based on that alone. If I don’t consume animal products but I fantasize about eating a cheeseburger I would still be a vegan.
Nobody is going to literally say “just do less racism” but in practice we often only deal with small parts of someone’s racism.
Maybe in my mind, I just think it’s a bit weird to glorify it in a way. If someone would come to me and proudly say “I’m only 20% racist now!”, I don’t think my initial reaction would be “Great, keep going!”. It would probably be more like “Why are you any % racist in the first place?”.
All of us are subconsiously a tiny percent racist due to growing up in racist power structures. You’re not a true ally if you think you’re perfect and zero % racist
What I mean is, some things in society are absolutely not accepted, and we wouldn’t congratulate people on just doing less of these things. For me, factory farming of animal products is one of these things. I do realize that some people don’t consider it to be.
Again, I wouldn’t say I disagree with the original comment, I just have some conflicting thoughts about it I guess. Hope this makes sense.
While I agree with the sentiment, I still struggle a bit with this rhetoric. When it comes to misogyny or rasicsm you wouldn’t tell someone to just try and do less of it. The meat & dairy industry is still a whole lot of abuse and exploitation, and I think everyone is probably on board with having nothing to do with it. The friction is just too high I guess.
The friction is precisely why I recommend start small. Better someone eat less meat and stick with it long term, than a full meat diet long term because they went completely meatless at once for a week or two and couldn’t handle it
Actually yes you would. For the average person in the privileged position, “trying to do less racism” or “trying to be less misogynistic” is the crux of actioning allyship, especially when people are imprinted and socialized from a young age to be/act racist and misogynistic without knowing or understanding it. Kids can’t necessarily control that, but trying to undo it by being less racist and less misogynistic day by day is the necessary work of anti-racism and feminism.
It also ignores that even allies almost always still hold some misoginy or racism, simply due to upbringing. True allies have to admit that we’re not done progressing.
Not only allies. There is a lot of internalization of misogyny, racism, homophobia, transphobia, etc. if you are a member of one of the affected groups but were raised in such environment.
I agree, but I think framing the goal is important.
I think the better way to go about it is to commit fully from the start. Maybe there’s some hiccups, and then you can reset and try again. I guess it’s very personal however. Some people might benefit from another mindset. Anything that gets people away from abuse, I’m all for.
comparing women and minorities to animals is what misogynists and racists do
And realizing that all humans are animals is what biologists do.
Analogies don’t prove anything, so we can play this game all day
Agreed.
Idk, these are very different things. If I think about how much I hate (some group) then I may be a racist based on that alone. If I don’t consume animal products but I fantasize about eating a cheeseburger I would still be a vegan.
Nobody is going to literally say “just do less racism” but in practice we often only deal with small parts of someone’s racism.
Well, frame it as “not one person doing it perfectly but thousands doing it imperfectly”
I’m not saying it’s bad.
Maybe in my mind, I just think it’s a bit weird to glorify it in a way. If someone would come to me and proudly say “I’m only 20% racist now!”, I don’t think my initial reaction would be “Great, keep going!”. It would probably be more like “Why are you any % racist in the first place?”.
All of us are subconsiously a tiny percent racist due to growing up in racist power structures. You’re not a true ally if you think you’re perfect and zero % racist
Maybe it was a bad example, excuse me.
What I mean is, some things in society are absolutely not accepted, and we wouldn’t congratulate people on just doing less of these things. For me, factory farming of animal products is one of these things. I do realize that some people don’t consider it to be.
Again, I wouldn’t say I disagree with the original comment, I just have some conflicting thoughts about it I guess. Hope this makes sense.
On a societal level that IS how we progress… Sorry but don’t let idealism block progress