how tf am i supposed to get any work done now?
Gaaaggghhhh! Somebody turn it back on! I’m starting to form my own thoughts again! It hurts!
Oh shit. I think I did it.
Honest question, does the world productivity goes up or down?
It depends on if quality is a product of productivity.
I would say it goes down. After all the slop users are not going to suddenly discover critical thinking.
Hey now let’s give them some credit, they may also drink poison and die without their thinking machine.
depends what you mean by productivity. cost based efficiencty has risen but at the expense of future capacity. We are kinda taking long term into account sometimes but very often even that is thrown off in the short term. Like organic and regenerative farming have been increasing as well as this thing called precision but im not sure that leaves the soil as good or better than it started it just sorta tech farming. Its a small minority that does any of that and if they seel the land the next owner may do the common farm technique that erodes the land so there is no way to know how long term it will be. granted everything im talking about does not even necessarily use ai.
It’s because it’s too good.
Waiting for the Anthropic PR saying that the outage was due to their new Claude Mythos model trying to escape confinement and being so powerful that it brought the whole Anthropic down.
Mythos is just too intelligent and immediately realizes the best thing it can do is kill itself.
is calude a rebranding of chatgpt or is it like a version?
Claude is from Anthropic, ChatGPT is from OpenAI.
ok I actually had to look it up. The way anthropic came from openai I had it in my head they were the same thing.
It’s incest all the way down.
What would their baby be called?
OpenClaudesButt?
OCB is giving me really bad answers today…
ClawedBot?
Good good. Please more of this!! Shut it all down.
As long as stackoverflow doesn’t go down too. I’ll have to start banging my head against the keyboard if they both go down…
Do people even post questions there anymore? And do they get answers from real people?
No idea, I haven’t in a long time. But there’s a huge amount of stackoverflow answers the current generation if AI was trained on.
If you want to simulate running Claude while it’s offline, just go run the faucet in your kitchen.
Oh no. Anyways
And nothing of value was lost
yeah this has been normal for them since they’ve become extremely popular after chatgpt got with the US military
They’ve been up and down near daily for like the last 2 weeks, unfortunately they just don’t seem to be able to get enough compute to handle how popular they are
I’ve been hitting a few errors processing requests, usually just repeating the request a few seconds later will get a normal response.
Clearly SaaS isn’t working out, so just open source all the frontier models and stop building data centers so we can all buy our own GPUs.
do it yourself, like in the distant past of *checks calendar* six months ago
Claude is used mainly for writing code, it is substantially faster at writing code than a human
If it writes a bunch of code, but it’s mostly slop and dogshit and introduces bugs at an alarming rate, does speed matter?
Hello! You are the 1908321094318709312th person to say this line today, here is your award 🍰
I’ll take that as a sign you’ve never written a single line of code in your life, since if you actually did so, you’d soon realise it’s like having a fast typing, cocaine fuelled intern as a sidekick, who only saw a couple stack overflow code snippets in your language of choice and ran with it.
ok? 👍
Then maybe there’s something here to learn from for you. Or don’t and assume that your vibe coding skills are the same as career engineers who’ve dedicated their lives to writing quality systems and producing beautiful code?
If it speeds up your workflow by that much (and I’ll admit it does make some tasks trivial for me now) that’s way more telling about your current skillset than the general state of the art.
i don’t get it what am i supposed to be learning?
Or don’t and assume that your vibe coding skills are the same as career engineers
I don’t? stop assuming im a professional coder, i’ve said multiple times what i use it for in this very thread
producing beautiful code?
tell that to microsoft and salesforce and slack and jira and every other piece of junk software that was garbage before ai
if ai is fixing bugs in their shitty “beautifully coded” software so much the better
code is not the product. code is the tool we use to build the product. it’s not about swinging your hammer, it’s about knowing where to put the nails.
That’s kind of a point for it? If the code isn’t the product, then it doesn’t matter who made it if the product is built properly. And sota models certainly know where to put the nails.
A better analogy would be a 3d printer. Much quicker than carving stuff out of wood. Might fail a print but it’s still faster. It’s not exactly food safe so avoid using it for something important. Obviously, it works well for small things but trying to build a house out of 3d printed bricks is going to yield failure.
Not the best analogy though but nails and hammers and monkeys is just missing the point completely imo.
after the client leak i should think it was even more poignant. a bit like tearing down a wall and finding it full of mouldy razor blades
Not sure what you mean by this tbh. The client list in relation to the product? Do you mean the source code leak? That’s a bit what I mean by it not being safe for everything and trying to build a house out of 3d printed bricks. I’m not even certain the code leak was caused by AI generated code anyways.
I personally only build small internal apps for the rest of the team. We don’t ship software.
Granted, every tool has its use and most can be used for the wrong thing if you try hard enough. It’s also easier to use it for the wrong thing with AI, has to be said.
think of it like this. you build small tools for internal use, so code quality, maintainability and documentation are not your highest priorities, right? most important is to ship the features needed by your colleagues right now. i’ve been in that same boat, building internal testing tools for a big multinational.
say your tool contains shortcuts for interacting with some internal database. you don’t need auth because it’s all on the internal net, so it’s just a collection of shortcuts. you don’t really care about maintainability, because it’s all just temporary, so you throw every new request together in the fastest way you can, probably trying out new techniques to keep yourself entertained. you don’t really care about testability, because you’re the only one testing so you can check that everything works before doing a release and if something slips through one of your colleagues will walk down the hall and tell you.
now imagine it gets enough attention that your boss says “we want our customers to use this”. suddenly your priorities are upended: you absolutely need auth, you definitely need testability and you absolutely definitely need the tool to not mess things up. best possible world, you can reimplement the tool in a more manageable way, making sure every interface is consistent, documentation is up to snuff for users, and error handling is centralised.
the claude cli leak is the opposite of that. it’s the worst code quality i’ve ever seen. it’s full of errors, repeated code, and overzealous exception handling. it is absolutely unmaintainable. the functionality for figuring out what type a file is and reading it into a proper object is 38 000 lines of typescript, excluding the class definitions. the entire thing is half a million lines. the code for uploading a pdf calls the code to upload jpegs, because if a file isn’t identified it’s automatically a jpeg. and jpegs can go through the same compression routine up to 22 times before it tries to upload them because the handler just calls itself repeatedly.
and this is the code they thought was robust enough to withstand the internet. imagine what their internal tooling looks like.
Not just where to put the nails but also how hard to swing the hammer, when to stop swinging it, etc.
Question is do we need more code, or better code?
The key to successful use of AI is: use it to write better code, not more code. This means iterations - just like when humans write code.
It’s substantially faster than most programmers at finding bugs too.
*creating
Both. So, if you - or other meatbags - write the code, AI agents can review it faster / more thoroughly (therefore: better) than human reviewers, finding more problems and proposing fixes.
If you accept every fix your reviewer proposes, human or AI, you’re an idiot. But if you ignore every bug a human or AI reviewer raises as a possibility, you’re an even bigger idiot. If your code has no bugs, you’re a liar.
more fuel for the vim-emacs holy war
Who are you asking that question to? I don’t care about your code, make it as shitty as you want
Less code is better code. And you’re response indicates you do not understand that point.
You’re right I have no idea, I use it for scripts, it works well, you guys are all linux nerds talking about philosophy that I don’t care for
I need code to make a script, it works, end of story, I don’t care about your philosophy on less code more code better code worse code, and I’m pretty sure most businesses don’t care either
I’m a C++ programmer most of the time, but I also write scripts. Claude and even Gemini write better bash scripts than I do - better error handling, better commenting, better input sanitizing, better use of parameters - because, all that bash syntax is an annoying pile of illogical junk that I have to look up every time I go to use it, and what are AI agents really fast at doing? Looking stuff up.
bash syntax is an annoying pile of illogical junk
🤣 so true!
I picked up python fairly quickly but bash my gosh
sure let’s just burn down half a hectare of the amazon for a seven line script.
engineering philosophy is where the rubber hits the road. building software with the right philosophy can mean the difference between needing a datacenter or a raspberry pi for the same job. it directly translates to money saved in recurring costs.
The seven line script isn’t burning down the rainforest. Programmers are a 1% slice of AI token usage. A seven line script takes less datacenter power to generate than your monitor does to show you this message thread while you read it. What’s burning down the rainforest is billions of “ordinary” people using AI to make Rule 34 animations, graphic layout flyers for their next coffee date, research papers on obscure topics that will never be read by anyone, schemes to trade bitcoin, etc. etc. etc.
sure let’s just burn down half a hectare of the amazon for a seven line script
that would probably be a couple hundred tokens so the same energy use as a google search
Stop talking as if you give any semblance of a shit about the art and craft of programming. You clearly don’t.
upvoted because you’re right, i don’t care?
edit: javascript sucks btw i hate it, it can suck MY art and craft
You can always tell who the vibe/shit/non coders are by the way they pontificate AI as some revolution that completely changes software, instead of yet another tool that has significant tradeoffs…
“But mongo DB is web scale!?!” — dunning-krugers
faster != better
In fact,
faster != good
Slow is smooth, smooth is fast
Speed and quality are basically uncorrelated, except in the big picture where slower -> better -> fastest to a real solution for the whole system.
The reason slower leads to better is due to iterations of examination and consideration of more possible use cases. It’s not about wall clock time, it’s about understanding the problem. AI agents let you shoot yourself in the foot 10x faster, but they also help you work through the edge cases faster too - not 10x faster, because the agent can’t know the edge cases as well as a domain expert can, but still faster.
works for me and apparently a shitload of other people because the thing is so popular it can’t stop crashing from people using the hell out of it
It can be rather helpful for some things but I’ve yet to see any actual data supporting it being “substantially faster”. To make something that works and is of equal quality, that is.
I mean if you’re just making the same slightly different website for different customers or similarly boilerplate stuff, I’m sure it’s substantial. But that’s not really most of dev.
If you’re reading a study performed 6, or even 3 months ago, you’re getting significantly stale data - it really is moving that fast.
Yeah i duno, it’s helped me make a massive script to automate a hugely time consuming part of my job saving literally 10’s of thousands of hours of work, I’m using it to also setup a boilerplate website that links to our backend to monitor services, it has also helped me setup home automation which makes me money (export power to grid during peak time), and I use it daily for any number of things, it’s great
Seems to work well for other people as well:
Claude Code hit $1 billion in annualized run-rate revenue in the first six months after its release and has since grown to $2.5 billion, the company said. Once used primarily by AI-forward startups, Claude Code has gained traction with engineering teams at Fortune 500 companies and even among hobbyists lacking technical skills who are interested in building their own apps. It’s been used for everything from growing a tomato plant to helping plan the route of a NASA Mars rover. On social media, users describe themselves as “Claude-pilled,” or Claude-obsessed.
But who knows, maybe it’s just 3d printing 2.0
maybe it’s just 3d printing 2.0
3D printing was awesome. Once or twice a year, it could make something for me that was genuinely useful. It also occupied a big chunk of space in the house and mostly created mostly useless plastic junk creating more clutter - we started 3D printing in 2018 and gave the printer away to someone with a bigger house in 2020. Once since then I have asked him to print something for me. It’s that useful.
AI agents are making software. I’ve got Terabyte flash drives smaller than a key fob - the clutter won’t be a problem in our house anytime soon. So far, Claude has helped me cleanup / fix several hobby software projects in amazingly short time to an amazingly high level of polish.
The outages have been so brief, and the speed margin is so great now, that waiting for the outages is a trivial delay as compared to “doing it the old fashioned way.”
I just used Claude yesterday to add some functionality to an existing python script that interacts with AWS. It created an unnecessary loop where 2 of 3 iterations were effectively no-ops. So while it did ultimately provide what I needed, I still had to refactor what it generated in order to remove the useless loop.
Remember, it was trained on Stack Overflow… a self-selected collection of “beginner” questions with a lot of “this is good enough to get you unstuck” answers. If you want better, you have to specify and test to ensure you get better.
Many monkeys can in fact swing hammers harder and faster than humans.
It doesn’t really make them better at it though
why are there so many lemmy users throwing weird analogies about monkeys and hammers at me
You’re supposed to be a smarter monkey?
I’m not sure
Fair
It’s all an illusion. You don’t need Claude to create, the ability has always been in you
You also don’t need higher level programming languages. The ability to code assembly has always been inside you.
I don’t need Claude to create, the ability has always been in me - but it comes out much more slowly without tools that assist me, whether that’s books with example code, websites that document APIs, community sites that discuss problems and solutions, web searches that bring me reference material related to what I’m doing, or AI agents which propose formal requirements and code that implements those requirements complete with tests.
It’s all my “creativity” - but a lot of professional programming more resembles painting a house than a still-life canvas. Painting a house using tiny art brushes is possible, but it takes a lot longer than using a spray-gun.
the real Claude was the friends we made along the way
The friends we made was also Claude, though.
What if Claude was one’s only friend, though?
Asking for aClaudefriend.I’m pretty sure the real Claude is up there outside on the sky though
Is Claude in this chat?
No it’s ok I blocked the Claude user from my repos
Claude doesn’t have the ability to create images, it’s mainly used for work
Sometimes work requires images. Claude is pretty awesome at making .svg files illustrating - pretty much whatever you can describe.
You mistyped illusion right?
I blame my current machine for this…
Fuck “AI”
Oh my clord!
