As a European living in the US now for many years the temperature scale is the least of my annoyances. It’s easy enough to memorize be ranges for what to wear. Fahrenheit is more granular, which is nice sometimes but really doesn’t matter.
No, let’s convert all the ridiculous weight/volume measures first. Having two kinds of ounces makes no sense. Measuring solids by volume (mostly) doesn’t make sense. Having different units for different magnitudes doesn’t make sense.
Fortunately things are often labeled in both metric and customary units so I can convert way easier.
Now if you’ll excuse me I’m going to have my 12 fluid ounces of coffee and a 1/3 cup of oatmeal.
Measuring solids by volume (mostly) doesn’t make sense.
This could be apocryphal, but I seem to recall hearing that a lot of American recipes got established during times of westward expansion, and that it made more sense for people moving out to the frontier to carry a measuring cup and a set of spoons that it did for them to carry a carefully-calibrated scale.
Yeah that makes sense. And in a pinch (no pun intended), measuring your solids by volume or even just eyeballing it is good enough for a lot of cooking (baking is a different matter).
But let’s not forget that Europe was not always metric, either. They went through the same process. They had the same units (or similar units) as US has now, with a lot of the same quirks. That was the entire point of the metric system: have one consistent set of units. United States was onboard early for metrication, but backed out before it completed it, so here we are.
I know it’s all based on what’s familiar, but I imagine I’d have a hard time converting to Celsius for a weather report. I’ve lived in tropical climates in the US for over half my life so when people say things like “it’s a hot 30 degrees out there!” it just short-circuits my brain.
I’ve had to translate recipes from Norwegian to American and this struggle is real. Never thought I’d need to look up material density tables for cooking.
I accidentally a word. Converting recipes from Norwegian and metric to American and US customary units.
I’m aware. I have a scale, too. But most people didn’t weigh dry ingredients. So when I translate for someone else I have to use the “normal” measures they’re used to. For myself, I speak the language and just use metric, my scale, and a measuring cup with both markings.
If they’d just standardized on one unit per measurement and apply si prefixes it’s still an imperial unit but easier to work with. Say a quart for volume, and a yard for distance, because they’re close to liter and meter. But I guess a kiloyard and a deciquart is taking it too far.
Yeah I think at that point it would be easier to just go metric.
Most Americans actually seem to be five with metric and probably would not mind it too much if we just switched. The objections are basically: 1) it’s too expensive to switch now (okay), or 2) it’s part of our identity (doubt). I swear to God everything is a culture war with some people.
More rational people, especially in STEM where it’s already the standard, prefer it.
In general though, I would argue that Americans know metric better then Europeans know US customary, for what that’s worth
It’s mostly about what you’re used to. Americans buy soda in liters, run 5km and do drugs by the gram. But we buy gasoline and milk in gallons and our recipes call for flour by volume. It’s mostly inertia. At the end of the day you have to communicate with people around you so you use units they understand.
But you don’t switch in one go, so costs can be spread out over years. First you would do double labeling, roll that out slowly, and with time the customary units slowly fades out.
Sure, I get that, and we already have dual labeling on a lot of stuff, maybe even most of the stuff. The problem there is that nobody actually reads the other labeling, so they are also not learning.
They need to go back to what they were doing before: First decide that we’re moving over so that mandates can be enforced.
Second, do what you were saying, and do dual labeling during the transition–but make metric most the prominent.
Third, educate kids in schools to use it (this already happens to a degree).
Fourth, launch massive informational campaigns to teach people how and why to use metric.
Fifth, step down the dual labeling gradually as more people are comfortable with the new units.
I expect there to be a long tail of non-metric units in use (see UK), but if we can switch more things over that is still an improvement. Heck, I’ll even take them just decimalizing and removing some smaller units (like lbs/oz).
The history of metrication in the US is as frustrating as it is an interesting read. It can certainly be done and many countries have shown it can be done, but it takes commitment and support from the highest levels.
Saying its too expensive to change is bullshit. Metric is common enough that most people who care about units at all end up having one set of tools for each system so they can use both as needed. This includes industry and machinists. It wouldn’t actually cost anything to change at this point we could just stop designing new things in imperial units and in a couple decades we would barely need imperial tools anymore, except to work on old stuff. Some engineers are just as pig headed as anyone though, so they just keep using imperial even though they know both, use both, and still run into problems with imperial.
Having the more granular temperature seems more practical. I often find myself adjusting my thermostat by just a single degree F. Do heating/ac thermostats in Europe use half degrees as increments? Even then I don’t think it’s as granular. But just integer values would be super annoying.
Because it’s mass produced consumer goods operating on a “below x temperature turn on heat/turn off AC” and “above y temperature turn off heat/turn on AC”. Old ones are just bimetallic strips where you change the trigger position with a slider, and modern ones use commodity grade temperature sensors, and neither is guaranteed to be placed particularly far from the vent.
The sensor is typically on the thermostat. Not at the vents. You would typically place the sensor in a central location in the house. A high quality multi speed motor AC is designed to keep a decently consistent temperature which is a bit more complex than just turn on / turn off. If you’re dropping $15k to $30k on central AC, they aren’t going to cheap out on a poor quality temp sensor.
It’s just not that fine tuned of an instrument. The furnace also runs on intervals so it’s just going to naturally fluctuate a bit. Like with anything “it depends”, but I doubt it’s possible to keep the room within a tenth of a centigrade just with a consumer level thermostat. Maybe in a small room with resistive heating? I’d love to see actual measurements of this.
Thermostats are not exactly calibrated machines unless you spend for a high end model. Put a few next to each other and they might differ 1°C, 2°F. Worse if you take the really cheap stuff.
It’s funny because all of the imperial units are mathematically based on metric anyway.
I’m an American, so I started with imperial units, but I am making the very slow progression of converting to metric. I already use metric for work, and it’s already the scientific standard here and has been since the 70s. It’s just turbo annoying to try and get used to a new measuring system that I use reflexively especially when surrounded by imperial units. Makes it too easy to trip up and fall back.
I think they mean ounces, cups, quarts, gallons, with no intuitive sense of conversion between them. I personally use ounces for almost everything (cocktail recipes are in 0.25 ounce increments, big cups are 40 ounces, big ol buckets can be 256 ounces). I might mess with gallons for very large amounts, but anything that can be expressed in cups or pints I’m usually just talking ounces anyway.
Your assumption is correct. I meant using cups, ounces, etc separately or in combination. Especially annoying when trying to figure out portions. Serving size: 8oz, package size: 1lb 4 oz. You have to do math every time.
As a European living in the US now for many years the temperature scale is the least of my annoyances. It’s easy enough to memorize be ranges for what to wear. Fahrenheit is more granular, which is nice sometimes but really doesn’t matter.
No, let’s convert all the ridiculous weight/volume measures first. Having two kinds of ounces makes no sense. Measuring solids by volume (mostly) doesn’t make sense. Having different units for different magnitudes doesn’t make sense.
Fortunately things are often labeled in both metric and customary units so I can convert way easier.
Now if you’ll excuse me I’m going to have my 12 fluid ounces of coffee and a 1/3 cup of oatmeal.
This could be apocryphal, but I seem to recall hearing that a lot of American recipes got established during times of westward expansion, and that it made more sense for people moving out to the frontier to carry a measuring cup and a set of spoons that it did for them to carry a carefully-calibrated scale.
Yeah that makes sense. And in a pinch (no pun intended), measuring your solids by volume or even just eyeballing it is good enough for a lot of cooking (baking is a different matter).
But let’s not forget that Europe was not always metric, either. They went through the same process. They had the same units (or similar units) as US has now, with a lot of the same quirks. That was the entire point of the metric system: have one consistent set of units. United States was onboard early for metrication, but backed out before it completed it, so here we are.
I know it’s all based on what’s familiar, but I imagine I’d have a hard time converting to Celsius for a weather report. I’ve lived in tropical climates in the US for over half my life so when people say things like “it’s a hot 30 degrees out there!” it just short-circuits my brain.
If accuracy is not critical you can use some simple tricks to convert between them.
30C is roughly…2 x 30 + 32 = 92F which is only 6 degrees off the actual value which is 86F.
I very much prefer to cook/bake/prep in metric grams.
2c white flour, sifted.
1c brown sugar, packed.
1c room temperature water.
2tsp active dry yeast.
2tbsp vegetable oil.
1/2tsp baking powder.
2 egg yolks.
5 egg whites.
Pinch of cinnamon.
Fuck you. Tell me how many grams that is. I don’t need five different tools to measure out my ingredients. I need a wet bowl, a dry bowl, and a scale.
Also this isn’t a real recipe I just started naming shit at random.
You made cake btw.
I’ve had to translate recipes from Norwegian to American and this struggle is real. Never thought I’d need to look up material density tables for cooking.
“To American” … what?
We have kitchen scales, we know how to weigh ingredients.
Old recipes in English often use volume measurements, across the pond too.
Modern recipes use weights when possible.
Idk why you’d convert to
ye olde style.I accidentally a word. Converting recipes from Norwegian and metric to American and US customary units.
I’m aware. I have a scale, too. But most people didn’t weigh dry ingredients. So when I translate for someone else I have to use the “normal” measures they’re used to. For myself, I speak the language and just use metric, my scale, and a measuring cup with both markings.
If they’d just standardized on one unit per measurement and apply si prefixes it’s still an imperial unit but easier to work with. Say a quart for volume, and a yard for distance, because they’re close to liter and meter. But I guess a kiloyard and a deciquart is taking it too far.
Yeah I think at that point it would be easier to just go metric.
Most Americans actually seem to be five with metric and probably would not mind it too much if we just switched. The objections are basically: 1) it’s too expensive to switch now (okay), or 2) it’s part of our identity (doubt). I swear to God everything is a culture war with some people.
More rational people, especially in STEM where it’s already the standard, prefer it.
In general though, I would argue that Americans know metric better then Europeans know US customary, for what that’s worth
It’s mostly about what you’re used to. Americans buy soda in liters, run 5km and do drugs by the gram. But we buy gasoline and milk in gallons and our recipes call for flour by volume. It’s mostly inertia. At the end of the day you have to communicate with people around you so you use units they understand.
But you don’t switch in one go, so costs can be spread out over years. First you would do double labeling, roll that out slowly, and with time the customary units slowly fades out.
Sure, I get that, and we already have dual labeling on a lot of stuff, maybe even most of the stuff. The problem there is that nobody actually reads the other labeling, so they are also not learning.
They need to go back to what they were doing before: First decide that we’re moving over so that mandates can be enforced.
Second, do what you were saying, and do dual labeling during the transition–but make metric most the prominent.
Third, educate kids in schools to use it (this already happens to a degree).
Fourth, launch massive informational campaigns to teach people how and why to use metric.
Fifth, step down the dual labeling gradually as more people are comfortable with the new units.
I expect there to be a long tail of non-metric units in use (see UK), but if we can switch more things over that is still an improvement. Heck, I’ll even take them just decimalizing and removing some smaller units (like lbs/oz).
The history of metrication in the US is as frustrating as it is an interesting read. It can certainly be done and many countries have shown it can be done, but it takes commitment and support from the highest levels.
Saying its too expensive to change is bullshit. Metric is common enough that most people who care about units at all end up having one set of tools for each system so they can use both as needed. This includes industry and machinists. It wouldn’t actually cost anything to change at this point we could just stop designing new things in imperial units and in a couple decades we would barely need imperial tools anymore, except to work on old stuff. Some engineers are just as pig headed as anyone though, so they just keep using imperial even though they know both, use both, and still run into problems with imperial.
Having the more granular temperature seems more practical. I often find myself adjusting my thermostat by just a single degree F. Do heating/ac thermostats in Europe use half degrees as increments? Even then I don’t think it’s as granular. But just integer values would be super annoying.
The ones in the UK go by half a degree.
Half a C is actually quite close to a whole F in delta. I don’t have a thermostat though.
I have not seen any thermostats in Europe with decimal degrees. But I also don’t think a thermostat is necessarily accurate to that level anyway.
lol you don’t think it’s accurate to a degree Fahrenheit? Why wouldn’t it be?
Because it’s mass produced consumer goods operating on a “below x temperature turn on heat/turn off AC” and “above y temperature turn off heat/turn on AC”. Old ones are just bimetallic strips where you change the trigger position with a slider, and modern ones use commodity grade temperature sensors, and neither is guaranteed to be placed particularly far from the vent.
The sensor is typically on the thermostat. Not at the vents. You would typically place the sensor in a central location in the house. A high quality multi speed motor AC is designed to keep a decently consistent temperature which is a bit more complex than just turn on / turn off. If you’re dropping $15k to $30k on central AC, they aren’t going to cheap out on a poor quality temp sensor.
It’s just not that fine tuned of an instrument. The furnace also runs on intervals so it’s just going to naturally fluctuate a bit. Like with anything “it depends”, but I doubt it’s possible to keep the room within a tenth of a centigrade just with a consumer level thermostat. Maybe in a small room with resistive heating? I’d love to see actual measurements of this.
Thermostats are not exactly calibrated machines unless you spend for a high end model. Put a few next to each other and they might differ 1°C, 2°F. Worse if you take the really cheap stuff.
It’s funny because all of the imperial units are mathematically based on metric anyway.
I’m an American, so I started with imperial units, but I am making the very slow progression of converting to metric. I already use metric for work, and it’s already the scientific standard here and has been since the 70s. It’s just turbo annoying to try and get used to a new measuring system that I use reflexively especially when surrounded by imperial units. Makes it too easy to trip up and fall back.
I’m not sure I get what you mean? Are you saying how we use ounces for tiny weights, pounds for “human”-ish weights, and tons for huge weights?
I think they mean ounces, cups, quarts, gallons, with no intuitive sense of conversion between them. I personally use ounces for almost everything (cocktail recipes are in 0.25 ounce increments, big cups are 40 ounces, big ol buckets can be 256 ounces). I might mess with gallons for very large amounts, but anything that can be expressed in cups or pints I’m usually just talking ounces anyway.
Your assumption is correct. I meant using cups, ounces, etc separately or in combination. Especially annoying when trying to figure out portions. Serving size: 8oz, package size: 1lb 4 oz. You have to do math every time.