The first one to jump ship. Many more to come.
Natural selection.
Many distros are now based on Debian Testing. I feel like they could come together and maintain a shared stable base, similar to what Ubuntu used to be for them. Kinda like the Open Gaming Collective guys did for their kernel development.
When my Tuxedo Pulse arrived, I turned it on once to marvel at the fact that it started up straight into Linux. Then restarted it to install Arch btw and never looked back. Fantastic laptop, tho.
Interesting. They are concerned about security updates delay, but then there is this: https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/securing-debian-manual/ch10.en.html#security-support-testing
Basically, it says that testing gets security updates later than stable and unstable.
This seems like slop for all the Ubuntu haters, but i agree moving to testing isn’t a good sign.
TBH while I like the hardware of my laptop, I’ve been pretty unimpressed by the software that Tuxedo provide.
While i appreciate not having snaps by default, the control center they ship is an electron app that requires /tmp be executable out of the box, and talks to a backend daemon that wasn’t particularly secure by default, and both live in /opt despite coming from the distro itself, so I think it’s ironic when people engage in technical sneering while throwing stones from within their glasshouses.
Also boot security doesn’t seem to be a priority for them out of the box, this seems like what they should focus on IMO, instead of switching their base
✘ CET OS Support: Unknown ✘ Linux kernel lockdown: Disabled ✘ Linux kernel: Tainted ✘ UEFI secure boot: Disabled
That it’s good enough as a distro, although I’ll probably just switch to neon if Tuxedo move to a rolling release base.
The thing is Neon could die at any moment thanks to KDE Linux.
Probably a good decision in the long run, their rational makes sense. Ubuntu’s stubborn insistence on snap is poor decision making on their part.
I run Tuxedo as my daily driver and look forward to the more rolling release focused strategy.
I don’t really have an issue with snap personally. The real problem is that their store doesn’t integrate with Flatpack properly. So the whole thing just gets clunky
The snapstore is proprietary that’s a no go.
i can’t speak for that… Or against it (I use fedora anyway). But, I would agree that snap is letting Ubuntu down at the moment, as there is a lot of good in ubuntu too
From a user side though, that’s because the whole ubuntu/snap store thing is just clunky, even if we ignore who controls the store. Gnome Software and discover I find are more usable than Snap store. Cosmic will likely catch up too
And if you add snap support to the other package software, it becomes a mess
I will give them credit for trying these things though, and feel bad for them that Mir, bazaar and snap didn’t really succeed
Sucks it will take a fresh install, but the whole reason I switched from arch was stability with new feature parity.
sorry, are you saying that Debian testing will be more or less stable than Ubuntu lts?
Moving away from Ubuntu makes absolute sense from what they describe.
I do wonder though, is basing a distro on Debian Testing a good idea? I understand them not wanting to go to the Debian stable as they already have issues with big drift for the cutting edge tools they want to ship breaking have the unintended consequences of breaking stable software. But Debian Testing will add in a constant shift in all the packages; they may be more recent but there is a much greater exposure to bugs.
Tuxedo’s OS will itself become a testing ground for packages in a way it wasn’t before. They’re both moving away from Ubuntu AND moving away from a LTS base. Though I suppose they can always re-base to Debian Stable at it’s next big release if they do find it too cumbersome.
Still, I wonder if this will happen with other distros. I know Mint has a Debian flavour which is seemingly described as a backup “plan B” in-case they felt the need to shift. I can also see the constant forcing of Snap into the ecosystem, and now the vague AI stuff that Tuxedo quote would also prompt a lot of distros to decide how dependent should they be on Ubuntu going forward.
Ubuntu is moving to MIT and could pull a CentOS at wny time.
The part that really calls my attention is the security aspect. I hope this was not overlooked but Debian testing receives delayed security patches compared to stable or even Sid.
It sounds kinda like Tuxedo also wants to be Debian’s Fedora.
That’s going to be good for all Debian users
Having btrfs+snapper set up by default sounds good. I wish Debian-based distros in general would finally make a move there. It’s a bit of a meme that folks laud Debian for its stability, but you can easily break it with one wrong command.
And who knows, maybe TuxedoOS adopting it can serve as a proof of concept and get Debian itself to adopt btrfs sooner.
laud Debian for its stability, but you can easily break it with one wrong command.
Well because that’s not the stability release schedules are talking about
Yeah, but that’s exactly the meme that I’m talking about.
It’s always ambiguous what is meant by stability. And as soon as you complain about Debian actually breaking very easily, folks will readily tell you about the technicality that it just means it doesn’t change very often.
It’s not really ambiguous at all.
A stable distro is one that doesn’t update packages except for security updates within the lifecycle of a release.
You can install debian 13 on release day in 2025 and when it gets deprecated in 2030 it will be functionally the same.
A byproduct of that is that apt updates are very unlikely to break anything.
None of that changes that you can run
sudo apt remove dpkgorrm -rf /ordd in=/dev/zero of=/dev/sda1(this one might actually work).But for your average desktop users it means you don’t boot up your laptop and have to learn how to use libreoffice 26’s new UI on the day you need to finish an assignment.
Of course, this is why I’m using MX Linux, it’s Debian based. systemd optional, no snap, no flatpak, stable.
This is the first post/reply in the wild about someone who uses MX Linux. I’m searching you guys for years, even though this distribution was on the top of Distrowatch for years.
Best distro ever, stable, Xfce4
Good decision. Ubuntu is a highly complex and specific all-in-one distribution never meant for customization.
Is Mint planning the same? I know they have their debian edition, but don’t remember of it was meant to become the main edition at some point.
It won’t happen any time soon unless Ubuntu does something drastic. I do think it would be a good idea for them to move in that direction, though.
It does make sense, though i think you’re right, and they won’t unless Ubuntu does something to force them. Ubuntu has lost so much good grace from the community. I remember the times it was basically the go to distro, and now a lot of comments are recommending not giving it a try.
I think it’s just a proof of concept in case they feel the need to switch the base. I didn’t head anything indicating that’s the case already
Probably. It is good as a backup though, they have options this way, if they decide Ubuntu isn’t a suitable base anymore, they already have things in motion.
