With the recent GN video I’d been wondering about turning an old mini PC from eBay into a little Linux TV box for streaming. I’d need access to Android apps (I guess through Waydroid).
After a brief look, it seems that the two options are some form of LibreElec system running Kodi or Arch running Plasma Big Screen. Any thoughts / advice? And if I went for Big Screen, does anyone know of any distros that ship with it or will I have to spin it up myself on Arch?
Maybe I’m crazy, but I don’t think the real problem here is “what to hook up to TV to watch shows”. Just about anything will do that. I primarily watch stuff on my computer already. Finding a convenient way to control the thing from the couch is a small hurdle, but a wireless keyboard with a built-in touch pad will get you pretty far for very cheap.
The biggest problem to me is the thing actually displaying video. TVs have gotten really cheap for consumers because of all of the spying. The idea that it is just LG is crazy, they are just the ones we know for sure and how deep because of GamersNexus, but it is naïve to think most other major brands are not doing the exact same stuff. There is also possibility of monitors doing the same thing (either already or will be very soon), and they don’t come in anything anywhere near as big as a typical TV today.
Where are we going to get the actual screens?
Large computer monitor? Though I realize that probably only works if you have (and want) a small TV like me.
I have two instances running debian on a lenovo think-something-or-other mini pc and a no name mini pc. Both are set for auto-login, and both fire up plex-htpc by default. I use a $10 remote I got off amazon that is “normal” on one side, with qwerty on the back. It also has a button you press to enable/disable a mouse cursor that you tip the remote around to control. Works well enough, and an old wireless mouse/keyboard stays tucked away if I ever need to do any real work on the system.
There were some annoying audio issues with Debian I fixed by nuking/reinstalling, but other than that it works pretty well as long as you know/are willing to learn how to write some scripts to auto-start some things. Plex-HTPC is 95% of what I use, the other 5% is using the browser to launch an owncast page that I stream… my bird-feeder… to for friends and family when they can’t access… my bird-feeder… in their market. It’s worth mentioning plex has DVR options if you’re willing to go that route.
Tl;Dr: Base regular setup of your choice as others are recommending, $10 remote off amazon, some scripting for start-up and some shortcuts on the desktop. I do recommend paying a bit more for a remote where the keyboard is backlit.
I tried Kodi, but support for streaming services is quite limited.
Now I’m running Android TV using Waydroid-ATV. I have Jellyfin, Youtube (with casting), and Dropout working which is an improvement over Kodi. I think I might be able to get the other streaming apps working if I figure out Widevine configuration, or some such thing.
I would recommend considering Plasma Bigscreen as an interface option.
What we need now, and maybe it exists, is a proper remote for this. In not keen on the idea of using hand held or full keyboards/mice. Or phones.
I bought the Flirc Skip remote and an using it on steam big picture mode. It’s not perfect, and I had some issues configuring it in Linux, but once I did it works pretty well. Can even navigate the steam ui. Fails on browser things though like YouTube in Firefox kiosk mode.
Same. I bought the Flirc USB + Skip 1s remote and they work okay… Their configuration apps are rough around the edges. The biggest hurdle I’ve had, though, is apps not supporting remote/keyboard input very well.
Yeah. I’ve not really figured out a good way to deal with the streaming services inside steam or plasma.
This is the best one I’ve found that works well with a proper PC like one running KDE ≥6.7 with Plasma Bigscreen, and I’ve tried a few. The only thing I miss is no voice control, but it has controls you’d want for Bigscreen
Seems neat but this is what I want to avoid. I like being able to jam the big pause button without thinking. Training people in the family to hit space bar, or escape, or whatever and use the arrows 2 handed is not ideal.
Edit:
Something like this is actually good:
Get a Bluetooth version. Those USB dongles regularly go bad (ask me how I know), and the remote becomes useless without it.
That one breaks easily when dropped, is designed for Android so you’d need to map some buttons
It feels like Plasma Bigscreen needs someone to spin up a distros for it to be easy. I know KDE Neon has a spin so I guess that works, but ideally I think it’d be:
- Arch (lightweight, rather than Ubuntu)
- immutable (probably best that it’s fairly idiot-proof)
- set up with some basic apps and functionality set up (VacuumTube, Waydroid)
If anyone feels like making a distro like that then that’d be amazing…
Oh shit, I didn’t know this was a thing. I’ve just been running Plasma on a used mini PC, but Bigscreen seems like it could make for a more comfortable experience. Neat!
EDIT: Aaaand it’s not available in Debian 13. Well, that’s unfortunate.
I’ve run libreelec for years now with a flirc and connecting to Jellyfin. It is an awesome interface and certainly has the wife approval factor. Never tried Plasma Big Screen, so can’t comment on that.
Regular Linux running KDE (e.g. Kubuntu) is vastly superior to those streaming TV devices that run Android.
Just get a wireless keyboard and a regular wireless mouse. You won’t be disappointed.
KDE lets you increase the default zoom level for all applications to something like 225% without fucking everything up.
You’ll still need to go into your Firefox settings to increase the zoom level there, but those two places cover 99.999% of all streaming use cases.
I have two TVs running completely off arch. One is a Lenovo Tiny PC, the other is a home server I built.
The frontend for both is just the normal arch desktop, running cinnamon with just some visual customizations. Each one has autologin, and on boot they open to the desktop with icons for Plex and a web browser that has shortcuts to all our streaming services on its home page. I also had Kodi running on them, which is handy because you can boot into it, but everything I was using it for Plex did better. I don’t bother with a remote, I just use a Bluetooth mouse.
The little PC in my bedroom is basically just a frontend. The bigger system in my living room is a frontend but also runs a Plex server, some servarr apps, plus a bunch of unrelated services. My wife is not super tech-savvy but it’s intuitive enough for her to figure out the interface.
My biggest friction point is my one streaming sports app that won’t save my login longer than 7 days, so I have to keep logging in to it but I don’t have a keyboard attached. I use a virtual keyboard as a workaround but it takes forever to peck out my login that way, and the app will log me out in the middle of a game if my login expires. More annoying than anything.
I’m not familiar with Waydroid or Big Screen, and I don’t use either of these systems for gaming, so I don’t have any advice there.
Obviously not the most secure method in the world, but would it be worth putting that password in a text file so you can just copy it with a mouse click instead of grappling with the virtual keyboard? Or a one-line script that just sends the string to your clipboard?
ETA: Hopefully that password is unique to that app account to minimize the threat of compromise.
I’m trying on and off to do the same at the moment. Part of my problem as well is making it as accessible as possible for my wife who will simply just not use something as soon as there is even a minor amount of friction.
I tried initially to use steams big screen mode to have everything bundled together in an easy interface. I ran into problems with that though and how the likes of Netflix was basically just a browser forced into fullscreen. It worked great until you wanted to exit tk change services which just didnt work as it should (using a controller or a remote).
I want to try out plasma big screen to see if that can provide the easy to use interface because as it is right now I just have a browser open with the few services we use ready to go but navigation just is not fun when using an air mouse to try and hit tiny ass buttons.
I dont want to use kodi as I have always thought it was trash ans when I have used it before my wife flat out refused because of the interface.
So no suggestions I’m afraid but I will be watching this thread to see what other people have come up with to solve this problem.
The Kodi interface was really bad last I tried it, but it depends a bit on the skin. I remember when I was getting into it with libreElec many years ago, I used a remote control and had to manually edit the Kodi skin to get it to respond to the buttons the way I wanted and change the layout slightly. Huge pain for what’s supposed to be a TV appliance platform.
It does feel like such a subtle but firm line, that divides people who just want things to work and not demand anything in return, and people who see computing and media as inherently political and worth investing energy into, and critically choosing what to use and what to avoid. How we bridge that gap and wake people up is, in my mind, a bigger problem than any single use case.
People shouldn’t have to think about what companies are going to fuck them over or exploit them as they go about their daily lives. The modern world is far too complex. The government is supposed to protect the people from criminals and enemies, foreign and domestic, no matter what their organization or motives are.
As it stands, most of surveillance capitalism is criminal espionage — just a fascist/authoritarian invasion of privacy — and would be illegal if our political classes weren’t corrupt criminals themselves, pre-financed and pre-positioned by the oligarchs/plutocrats of the economic elite. The current clusterfuck is an illusion of “democracy” that is functionally-equivalent to capitalist dictatorship, where our governments actively collude with businesses to extract wealth from the population.
What I’m saying is that no appliance software should be surveilling you, period. None of the data brokers should exist. Most data collection and sharing that isn’t explicitly necessary to deliver a service should be illegal. People should be free to live in a world where the greatest concerns when buying a TV are the build quality, features, and UI. Not fucking covert malware or espionage. What is currently considered normal and acceptable is psychotic.
From where I’m standing, we don’t disagree about anything except for the power of the word “should”.
Yeh same thoughts as Brave Little. My fam are good with slight changes and will adopt if its easy. It ok if i do it in small stages and i explain what and why. I have the same long term plan with consoles/phones so moving has to be a discussion with give and take.
The biggest note is when i have visitors, if its too awkward they will baulk and try and connect the device the old way.
I don’t like Kodi either, tried it decades ago, even with advances and skins its still too overwhelming looking vrs a screensavers and cards approach. I kinda like having my apps separate somewhat like android.
I just run Debian with Kodi.
Helps to have something like this with a keyboard and air mouse/trackpad.
I either watch locally stored media or stuff on firefox though. Not sure about apps.
ETA: I see someone else here mentioned Plasma Bigscreen. If you choose Debian it won’t be available for a while. It was removed from Debian 13 because it hadn’t been updated in a while but someone has been working on it for a while now. Hopefully it’ll be back soon.
I haven’t found anything better than just Linux Mint on a mini PC and Logitech k400 with autostarting browser with bookmarks to streaming sites.
I wish there was a FOSS android distro for htpc/streaming boxes but that would probably just be blocked by Google and the rest of the streaming giants
There’s also the whole Netflix 720p on Linux thing…
Yarrr this was 1 of many reasons why I canceled Netlfix. At some point I was watching a movie that had a scene where the main character was kayaking at night and ran into some trouble. Due to their compression, (not only the 720 resolution), I literally couldn’t see what was happening in scene, it was just a bunch of giant black and grey blocks moving around the screen. I decided right then I was done paying for this shit.
At that point I’m paying for content that’s worse quality then when people used to cam new releases in theaters back in early 2000’s
You can run Lineage os on a TV box
For pure Linux you could run OSMC
There’s https://www.mythtv.org/ It’s heavier-weight than kodi, but includes its own OTA/cable setup for actual TV. Does not integrate as well with streaming services as kodi, but it seems like a lot of my kodi plugins have stopped working in the last couple years. Mythtv used to be bundled in a “Mythbuntu” distribution, but they seem to have collapsed.
Kodi frontend with a mythtv backend has been a pretty workable solution for me, but it won’t stream from Prime, Apple, Netflix, Disney, etc
I did something similar fairly recently as my Roku TCL kept getting worse. I had a NUC only running PiHole. I mainly use Plex with occasional YouTube via GrayJay so your use case may be different.
I tried LibreElec, but it kept hard crashing - maybe a video issue? And getting Pihole running on it was a pain.
I jumped to KDE Neon Big Screen, but Plex HTPC ran like a slideshow at 4k. Everything else ran fine but I didn’t spend much time troubleshooting.
I next tried Mint and got it working just fine. Plex, Grayjay, Pihole, and a cheap wireless remote with a keyboard on the back. I set the desktop scale to 200-300%, hid the taskbar, and put a couple huge icons on the desktop. It’s not perfect, but it’s simple enough for the kids to figure out.
This was an interesting little video about it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nROKp0BpFek
Yeah it’s interesting! Not sure if I’d take this exact approach - I really only want one android app so I think I’d be more open to Linux native apps for other things, and also I’d be more inclined to use Plasma than the launcher he went with
For many years, I’ve used a HTPC with a few different distributions. At the moment, it’s running Debian with Gnome. For me, this is good enough, since the UI allows me to easily do all sorts of computer stuff like having multiple virtual desktops, many browsers, lots of tabs, spreadsheets and a system monitor. Obviously, you need a wireless keyboard + touchpad combo to use this HTPC.
If you’re aiming for a more simplified UX, I would go with something like LibreELEC
