“In early 2014, there were clashes between rival groups of protesters in the Ukrainian city of Odesa, during the pro-Russian unrest that followed the Ukrainian Revolution.[21][22] The street clashes were between pro-revolution (‘pro-Maidan’) groups and anti-revolution (‘anti-Maidan’), pro-Russian groups. There were far-right elements on both sides.[23] Violence erupted on 2 May, when a ‘United Ukraine’ rally was attacked by pro-Russian separatists. Stones, petrol bombs and gunfire were exchanged. The first shots were by a pro-Russian gunman, who shot dead a pro-Ukraine protester.[24] Another pro-Ukraine activist and four pro-Russia activists were shot dead in the clashes that followed.[25][26][27][28] The pro-Ukraine protesters then moved to dismantle a pro-Russian protest camp in Kulykove Pole, causing some pro-Russian activists to barricade themselves in the nearby Unions House. Shots were fired by both sides, and the pro-Ukraine protesters attempted to storm the building, which caught fire as the two groups threw petrol bombs at each other.[29][30][31]”
If we wanted western disinfo we’d have gone to Wikipedia ourselves, not all of us like to keep our knowledge as surface level as possible.
This is the type of information that I would not search for in English Wikipedia, that has a pro-Western and pro-Ukrainian bias.
Source: Wikipedia?
15 downvotes on a post commemorating the death of a teenager? The uKKKraine stans are not ok
god forbid someone says something unwholesome about the smol bean country that sends all of its people to their death to please Amerikkka
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I think you misinterpreted this comment, though it is vague enough to interpret it either way.
oh my bad sry @GiorgioPerlasca@lemmy.ml
No problem! 😆
Rest in peace.
User added context: this happened during a separatist march that wanted the Odessa to leave Ukraine and join Russia & the far right organisation that did it, tried to become a political party and got 0.7% of votes.
I didn’t know him so I cant tell if he was a socialist, but the group he was part of was not trying to have a socialist revolution in Ukraine, but rejoin Russia (who is not socialist, so honestly no idea what you are talking about).
I cant tell if he was a socialist
Edit: Another clue is that they took refuge in the trade unionist’s building. Trade unionists are the third group (after communists and socialists) purged by fascists in Niemöller’s famous poem.
Then they came for the trade unionists
I cant tell if he was a socialist
lmao can’t make this shit up, are they even trying at this point
That poster is a Polish nationalist, lol.
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the group […] was not trying to have a socialist revolution in Ukraine, but rejoin Russia (who is not socialist, so honestly no idea what you are talking about)
Ukraine was not on the brink of a socialist revolution, but it was in the middle of a NATO-backed coup spearheaded by nationalist groups like the OUN which desired to exterminate socialists and ethnic Russians alike. The pragmatic course of action for socialists in such a predicament is to seek asylum with the nearby liberal democracy that opposes those same nationalist groups and with which you share cultural ties.
Even though Russia is sadly no longer socialist, as you point out, its socialist past is still held in high regard by many and the country is not tearing down its Soviet monuments and replacing them with ones dedicated to Nazi collaborators.
separatist movement
seek asylum
nearby liberal democracy
Russia
I, uh, do not believe we have the same definitions for those words.
I’m characterizing the separation as asylum for the entire oblast of Odessa.
Russia is a semi-presidential republic like France and Portugal. It’s not typically classified as a “liberal democracy” simply due to racism IMO[1]—although I’ll grant that it’s probably more homophobic than those two.
Edit: In truth, I think “liberal democracy” is a useless and chauvinist term. I used it to be provocative.
For example, the BBC is free to operate in Russia, but RT is not free to operate in the UK. Despite this, the UK is near the top of the “press freedumb” chart, and Russia is near the bottom, because Russians are mean and scary. ↩︎
I’m guessing unless a country actively participates in a genocide then it’s not a liberal democracy.
a political party [which] got 0.7% of votes
Which is that?
Read the thread, it’s mentioned and explained further in.
I have. Titushky is not a political party.
More user added context: the fascists were never charged or prosecuted for the massacres, and a different group of fascists is now in charge of the state having banned all political opposition and free media. The group he was part of was literally trying to avoid being swallowed up by a fascist state.
And the state ordered firefighters to keep away and let them burn
Despite numerous calls to the fire brigade, which was less than 1 km away, the fire service regional head instructed his staff not to send any fire engines to Kulykove Pole without his explicit order.[1]
European Court of Human Rights: State negligence in clashes between Maidan supporters and opponents in Odesa in May 2014 [PDF] ↩︎
I do wish lemmy would add a “user country of origin” feature.
The polish nationalist wants user location data so they can be racist to the designated bad nationalities who could have guessed.
Does he know how many Polish citizens did Ukraine collaborationists killed during World War 2?
There’s a reason Poland hates Ukraine more than pretty much any other country in Eastern Europe not counting Russia. Ukraine won’t even admit to the Nazi collaboration
What far-right organisation?
Right Sector
Wait by “that did it” do you mean the ones that committed the terror attack or the ones who organized the march?
You can find the answer here: https://en.azvision.az/news/10272/ukraine.html
You are asking the wrong person that question. I wrote “that did it”, GiorgioPerlasca linked the name of the org. Why are you asking him what I meant? Please be more attentive.
Ok what did you mean?
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The Ukrainian side (“Euromaidan”) did indeed include far-right organizations such as “Right Sector,” which played an active role in the events of that day. However, it is incorrect to reduce the entire pro-Ukrainian camp to the “far-right.” Among them were many football fans (ultras) and ordinary townspeople who held pro-Ukrainian views. On the other hand, the pro-Russian camp (“Anti-Maidan”) was equally heterogeneous. Its composition included not only “titushky” (paid provocateurs from the criminal underworld) but also ordinary citizens who were also gathering signatures for federalization and speaking out against the new government in Kyiv.
“Right Sector” was a key, but not the only, organizing force. Other nationalist groups also participated in the pro-Ukrainian march, as well as football ultras from Kharkiv and Odesa, who acted in alliance with them.
It is incorrect to say that “the Anti-Maidan organized the ‘titushky.’” The “titushky” themselves were an instrument. The term “titushky” denoted not ideological separatists, but people with athletic backgrounds and criminal pasts hired for money, who were used for violent actions and provocations. Their services were used by various political forces.
The European Court of Human Rights (ECtHR), having examined all the circumstances of the case, did not recognize “Right Sector” or any other organization as the sole perpetrator of the tragedy. The key conclusion of the ECtHR: the state of Ukraine failed to fulfill its obligations to prevent violence and save people. The Court found that the authorities could and should have stopped the bloodshed, but allowed “unacceptable delays” and “periods of inexplicable inaction.”
Anti-maidan (separatists) organized tituszki.
any source on that or??
