I’ve been thinking. Every mainstream social media is age verificated now. But sites such as SomethingAwful, 4chan and the Fediverse weren’t. So why are we trying to populate it if the Fedi’ was popular too, we would ALSO be verificated and spywared (made up this word for this post’s sake)?
A lot of the laws aren’t limited by the size of the site, or whether or not it’s non-commercial, so instances with users in some places with age verification laws already do; Australia, Mississippi, and the UK (with the Online Safety Act) are three example. I haven’t heard of any examples of instances getting warnings about this yet – although a couple instances with content that might be considered unsuitable for minors have geoblocked the UK to avoid triggering the Online Safety Act – but it’s only a matter of time.
Probably. Regulators usually care about reach, not architecture. If the Fediverse became genuinely mainstream, it would likely end up in the same political spotlight. The real difference is that federation makes compliance an instance by instance problem, not one global switch. That is much harder to enforce.
It already did, in Australia. Aussie Zone adopted a unique way to verify us. We sent images to Molly (after Molly Ringwald) and that was enough for the federal government. Things like username at a pub. I’m old and have false teeth so I sent a pic of those.
No, they didn’t like it and they said so, but they found a way round that worked.
It can but then again to counter it we have hash based protocols like reticulum and nostr
In theory, yes, but it would have to scale up significantly in order to be noticed. And then since it would be split across many difference instances would be a logistical nightmare for authorities.
didn’t they already carve an exception for open source?
You can just join another instance that is outside the jurisdiction of these laws or run your own instance with closed sign ups since you don’t have to verify your own age (or the age of known friends if you offer access to them)
The fediverse is inherently resilient to this sort of law, it’s the laws that make platforms liable for the content posted to it, that are more of a concern for the fediverse.
Age Verification laws, if they are ever enforced against the fediverse, will be enforced against instances, rather than the fediverse as a whole. So the federales will come for feddit.online, or lemmy.world or mastodon.social. The trouble is, to get the fediverse writ large taken down, you have to get every instance down all at once, otherwise the instances will just keep federating content between them. This seems impractical and kind of unlikely to succeed.
Then what’s to stop them from making a law forbidding doxxing-law-abiding instances from federating with instances that don’t force users to doxx themselves?
Perhaps they could. I’m just not clever enough to know how you would draft the legislation or enforce the law – how is a complaint instance supposed to identify a noncomplaint instance, short of checking everyone’s id again?
The key word being “instance” - they’d have a helluva time trying to take down the whole thing altogether. Much like pirate sites, chop one head off & two more will take its place. Communities will just migrate & reestablish footing elsewhere. If the feds do it enough, then backup plans will become automatic where instances back each other up.
What law? Where? How could it even be enforced on something completely decentralized?
They could go after some locally hosted instances I guess but the federated platforms as a whole do not have a “home base” and trying to enforce such a rule would be difficult if not impossible in practice (never mind that age verification was never about protecting anybody).
You openly defy it. Fuck you, Make me. Jurisdiction hop, darknets, etc.
thats not how it works. there is no company. if your server tries to age gate me, i’ll just use another.
I’ll run my own is also an option.
This is completely wrong
Age Verification laws have nothing to do with Fediverse “popularity”
They have only to do with the political jurisdiction of your instance, and the political jurisdiction of you as a viewer
I’m pretty sure ze’s (accurately) talking about how many of the enacted age verification régimes only mandate it for platforms with certain amounts of monthly active users.
It wouldn’t - it should already.
Why, you ask? Because these laws almost always appear to be first and foremost tools of surveillance and control, not for legitimate reasons, so everyone’s in these laws’ scopes. It’s just easier to go for the bigger players first, or even the US companies as they need to respect the laws of countries they operate in by American law too.
Flying under the radar can only delay the problem so much, so if it concerns you, or whomever else for that matter, do push against these laws, and understand people need to be as resilient as those pushing in favor of these laws.
In one description I saw, part of the criterion was algorithmic feeds i.e. viewer manipulation. Lemmy has a fairly wimpy form of that compared to something like Facebook, and it could be shut off entirely without any loss. If it were up to me I’d shut it off either way.
From what I understood of how the federation works it would be rather difficult to enforce it if anyone can run their own instance.
