this show failed to convince me that i need to give a flying fuck what happens next at the end of S2, and it’s really weird to me that people are still talking about it a generation later
I wonder if someone’s formalized an axiom that in any internet forum post about something popular, someone will feel the need to not add to the conversation but to declare that they personally didn’t like it and that it’s bizzare others did.
It’s a strange impulse but you see it over and over again.
I’m guilty of that but i always do it when i actually hated something and I’m politely downplaying how shite I thought it was.
I think this is essentially a statistics thing; any online collection of people will tend to have a normal distribution spread from hate to love for the subject matter.
The person who hates it the most will fill an environmental niche when they see nobody has said it yet. But we have to work with the environment:
a generally-neutral comments section leaves only room to politely dismiss/critique one or two select aspects of a show.
a generally positive one allows people at the RHS (“LOVE”) of the normal distribution free reign to gas it up, but only affords to the biggest hater in the room, enough space to say “well it was mid. It was alright i guess. It was overrated.”
likewise a generally-negative comment section will see people who only disliked it start to convince themselves that they HATED it, while the few who LOVED it have to pretend it’s “just alright” for fear of persecution
So now you see, U7826391786239 is a trailblazer; his negative-in-intent-but-ultimately-rather-ambivalent comment demonstrates typical no-man’s land behaviour. With this comment he has spread his seed over the virgin soil of this online ecosystem and allowed the great debate to begin again on whether GoT is a good show or not
i’m not comparing those two things. i’m pointing out that the “it’s popular = it must be good” argument is obviously ridiculous when you apply it to kanye. or any other terrible thing that’s “popular”
Well to be clear, Kanye’s recent music material output aside and awful public behaviour - his musical content is absolutely highly acclaimed historically by listeners and critics.
highly acclaimed historically by listeners and critics.
if that’s a good enough reason for you, then that’s what it is. from my perspective, “listeners and critics” factor 0% into what i consider to be worth my time
the entire point of this whole thread is “popular” does NOT automatically equal “good”
if your reasoning is that the music (or the show, or the painting, or whatever tf you want) is respected because “it’s respected,” then you’re doing literally nothing to support your position
I dont think I need to show evidence to support my statement, its common knowledge and I wouldnt expect anyone to try and dispute that Kayne’s music isnt considered good or respected.
The part that’s worth talking about, to me, is how creators and their audience can occasionally be on such different pages. What happens to the creative process to make that happen? Is it indicative of a deeper ill with the industry?
HBO is known for taking big swings and they used to depend on the fact that it didn’t matter how many of their shows sucked because eventually they’d make a GoT or The Wire, so it’s not weird to see one of their shows suck or be amazing… but it’s certainly memorable when they make one that does both.
HBO could kind of do that because they were THE premium channel and how a significant chunk of the US market actually watched movies.
Even by GOT? E’RYBODY was showing titties. Hell, I want to say AMC even was getting to push the envelope a bit? And Starz were outright hanging dong more often than not at that point (I will die on the hill that Spartacus was better written, better acted, and respected the audience more). And it was similarly around the time people were on to their bullshit (see SNL’s “It’s not Porn, it’s HBO” skit).
And with Netflix and Amazon both spinning up their own studios? It isn’t a surprise HBO reached the point that its branding was taken off the streaming service.
They’ve lost their niche in recent years, it’s true. Another casualty of “progress” just like episodic TV. Nowadays every showrunner thinks they can tell us “don’t worry, it gets good in an hour or two of screen time”, and as long as it’s captured the spotlight by the season finale, they’ve still got a job. Time wasters!
i think the “creators,” i.e. owners, producers, shareholders don’t really care either. deliver the product, that’s it. obviously quality doesn’t matter, because if it did, then the quality wouldn’t be absolute dogshit. but here we are, talking about it, which is really the end goal, isn’t it? keep people talking about it. and i didn’t even watch the damn thing. mission accomplished!
If you’re not having fun talking about it, nobody’s making you… But, you can make your own decisions.
There’s always that tension between creatives (artists) and the profit motive. It’s true for show runners, just as it is for small Etsy artists. Part of the artistry is pretending one wants to do what must be done, in order to recover a sense of genuine expression without losing the means to continue. Maybe that’s the difference between amateurs and professionals. A good showrunner must humble themselves in both directions at once - to the suits, and to their audience - and even then they will fail, unless they can convince us that’s what they wanted to do all along.
When mistakes are made and you lose your audience, it is all too easy to blame them for not liking it. A good comedian doesn’t argue with a crowd that isn’t laughing, obviously the only opinion that matters is theirs. You dig yourself out of that hole by admitting it and moving on. That’s what’s unprofessional (in the sense stated earlier) of the GoT team - not to take any criticism onboard. It will only limit their future creative to have that mindset. That’s the part that matters, who cares if it was profitable to the suits?
lately, nothing. i’ve been marathoning what i grew up with, star trek" TOS, TNG, DS9, voyager-- i tried to get into the “newer” ones, but they’re meh to me. i was initially interested in orphan black and squid game, but they got tedious and i lost interest
generally speaking i’ll avoid investing a single microsecond in a show until a) it’s 100% completed; and b) people don’t fucking hate the ending–which, apparently isn’t the case with GoT
I mean GOT still at least had 6 highly received seasons. I don’t think the ending degrades GOT as a series.
I also don’t think there’s anything especially wrong with gravitating towards media content that explores dark or violent themes in writing (seemingly a partial objection of yours to GOT?)
I don’t think the ending degrades GOT as a series.
the ending is the most important part. what’s the point of any of it if it’s not leading up to something? i have no problem with darkness or violence, but to claim those things as a unique or groundbreaking thing in defense of the show is what’s goofy to me. i mean it has boobies too. yea, and…?
It depends on how much quality there is prior to it to me. Endings do weaken the show overall to varying degrees if they are badly done or rushed, but there’s a lot of great content along-the-way.
this show failed to convince me that i need to give a flying fuck what happens next at the end of S2, and it’s really weird to me that people are still talking about it a generation later
I wonder if someone’s formalized an axiom that in any internet forum post about something popular, someone will feel the need to not add to the conversation but to declare that they personally didn’t like it and that it’s bizzare others did.
It’s a strange impulse but you see it over and over again.
I’m guilty of that but i always do it when i actually hated something and I’m politely downplaying how shite I thought it was.
I think this is essentially a statistics thing; any online collection of people will tend to have a normal distribution spread from hate to love for the subject matter.
The person who hates it the most will fill an environmental niche when they see nobody has said it yet. But we have to work with the environment:
So now you see, U7826391786239 is a trailblazer; his negative-in-intent-but-ultimately-rather-ambivalent comment demonstrates typical no-man’s land behaviour. With this comment he has spread his seed over the virgin soil of this online ecosystem and allowed the great debate to begin again on whether GoT is a good show or not
“popular”
man, you should see how i talk about trump supporters
You can debate the merits of the show but to give one of the most watched shows in history a “popular” just makes you look like a goof.
https://philosophy.lander.edu/logic/popular.html
kanye is one of the most listened to musics. fuck him too
Why would you compare GoT to Kanye?
i’m not comparing those two things. i’m pointing out that the “it’s popular = it must be good” argument is obviously ridiculous when you apply it to kanye. or any other terrible thing that’s “popular”
No one made that argument, though. The person you replied to literally said you can debate the merits of the show.
Well to be clear, Kanye’s recent music material output aside and awful public behaviour - his musical content is absolutely highly acclaimed historically by listeners and critics.
if that’s a good enough reason for you, then that’s what it is. from my perspective, “listeners and critics” factor 0% into what i consider to be worth my time
What logical argument did I make that invoked the show’s popularity?
I pointed out the fact that the show is/was popular.
Thats a bad comparison. Kayne’s music is very well respected.
the entire point of this whole thread is “popular” does NOT automatically equal “good”
if your reasoning is that the music (or the show, or the painting, or whatever tf you want) is respected because “it’s respected,” then you’re doing literally nothing to support your position
I dont think I need to show evidence to support my statement, its common knowledge and I wouldnt expect anyone to try and dispute that Kayne’s music isnt considered good or respected.
Who on Earth has made that arhument?
The part that’s worth talking about, to me, is how creators and their audience can occasionally be on such different pages. What happens to the creative process to make that happen? Is it indicative of a deeper ill with the industry?
HBO is known for taking big swings and they used to depend on the fact that it didn’t matter how many of their shows sucked because eventually they’d make a GoT or The Wire, so it’s not weird to see one of their shows suck or be amazing… but it’s certainly memorable when they make one that does both.
HBO could kind of do that because they were THE premium channel and how a significant chunk of the US market actually watched movies.
Even by GOT? E’RYBODY was showing titties. Hell, I want to say AMC even was getting to push the envelope a bit? And Starz were outright hanging dong more often than not at that point (I will die on the hill that Spartacus was better written, better acted, and respected the audience more). And it was similarly around the time people were on to their bullshit (see SNL’s “It’s not Porn, it’s HBO” skit).
And with Netflix and Amazon both spinning up their own studios? It isn’t a surprise HBO reached the point that its branding was taken off the streaming service.
They’ve lost their niche in recent years, it’s true. Another casualty of “progress” just like episodic TV. Nowadays every showrunner thinks they can tell us “don’t worry, it gets good in an hour or two of screen time”, and as long as it’s captured the spotlight by the season finale, they’ve still got a job. Time wasters!
I don’t know. Hollywood, in it’s entirety, sucks and amazes to the max. Like… that’s literally their thing.
i think the “creators,” i.e. owners, producers, shareholders don’t really care either. deliver the product, that’s it. obviously quality doesn’t matter, because if it did, then the quality wouldn’t be absolute dogshit. but here we are, talking about it, which is really the end goal, isn’t it? keep people talking about it. and i didn’t even watch the damn thing. mission accomplished!
If you’re not having fun talking about it, nobody’s making you… But, you can make your own decisions.
There’s always that tension between creatives (artists) and the profit motive. It’s true for show runners, just as it is for small Etsy artists. Part of the artistry is pretending one wants to do what must be done, in order to recover a sense of genuine expression without losing the means to continue. Maybe that’s the difference between amateurs and professionals. A good showrunner must humble themselves in both directions at once - to the suits, and to their audience - and even then they will fail, unless they can convince us that’s what they wanted to do all along.
When mistakes are made and you lose your audience, it is all too easy to blame them for not liking it. A good comedian doesn’t argue with a crowd that isn’t laughing, obviously the only opinion that matters is theirs. You dig yourself out of that hole by admitting it and moving on. That’s what’s unprofessional (in the sense stated earlier) of the GoT team - not to take any criticism onboard. It will only limit their future creative to have that mindset. That’s the part that matters, who cares if it was profitable to the suits?
Man, y’all really are dumb enough to feed the troll, huh?
What’s not to enjoy? Incest + creative torture and murder. That’s an 8 season idea right there.
you can go to pornhub for the first two things, and just look at news if you enjoy murder.
why bother with all the soap opera shit
What TV do you like, exactly?
lately, nothing. i’ve been marathoning what i grew up with, star trek" TOS, TNG, DS9, voyager-- i tried to get into the “newer” ones, but they’re meh to me. i was initially interested in orphan black and squid game, but they got tedious and i lost interest
generally speaking i’ll avoid investing a single microsecond in a show until a) it’s 100% completed; and b) people don’t fucking hate the ending–which, apparently isn’t the case with GoT
I mean GOT still at least had 6 highly received seasons. I don’t think the ending degrades GOT as a series.
I also don’t think there’s anything especially wrong with gravitating towards media content that explores dark or violent themes in writing (seemingly a partial objection of yours to GOT?)
the ending is the most important part. what’s the point of any of it if it’s not leading up to something? i have no problem with darkness or violence, but to claim those things as a unique or groundbreaking thing in defense of the show is what’s goofy to me. i mean it has boobies too. yea, and…?
It depends on how much quality there is prior to it to me. Endings do weaken the show overall to varying degrees if they are badly done or rushed, but there’s a lot of great content along-the-way.