- Grimgar
- Mushoku Tensei
- Hunter x Hunter (2011)
- Frieren
- Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood
- Dorohedoro
- Dungeon Meshi
- Made in Abyss
- Ascendance of a Bookworm
- One Piece
From the most recent discussion about the best anime worldbuiiding, my choices continue to be Made in Abyss—as in I agree with the article in this case—and Violet Evergarden, but Witch Hat Atelier is getting to be a contender.
God the world building in FMA:BH is elite.
I also hate that the world building in Made In Abyss is so good, because its a show I can’t in good conscience watch.
FMA2003 as well. I love that we got two very different worlds from that manga.
Brotherhood had a better ending, but the original did more interesting things with the homunculi.
Why can’t you watch it ? (Honest question, I don’t know it)
The manga author has included quite a bit of thinly veiled child fetishes in the manga - they’re sommmmeewhat less blatant in the anime but its still just gross
I see. Thanks
Watched Frieren last month and it is just so good. I have recommended it to several people now and cannot wait for the next season. I just watched Blue Eyed Samurai and it was good as well, not Frieren level good, but a good story nonetheless.
Grimgar is quite an intersting choice—older, obscure, downbeat single-cours isekai. Maybe the listmaker read the LNs?
I’d add The Twelve Kingdoms, and possibly The Slayers and Kyo Kara Maoh! to this (there’s plenty in both to explore, but both sometimes drop something silly for purely comedic purposes, like the vegetarian sharks).
I’d say The Twelve Kingdoms blows basically everything else on this list out of the water in terms of world building.
A little addition:
- Attack on Titan
- Re:Zero
- Gachiakuta
- Sentenced To Be A Hero
- Berserk
Frieren is great fun, but I actually think worldbuilding is a major weakness for the series. It’s all very surface-level and leaves the impression that the author hasn’t really thought things through.
It’s a slice of life series. For what its main focus is, it’s decent enough. It’s the “two-layer rule.” Why don’t vampires travel in the sewers? Sewer alligators. Why are there sewer alligators? Sewer alligator-taming vampire-hunting nuns. Why are the nuns there? To keep vampires from using the sewers. You answer two questions, and then loop it back into the main idea. It reinforces the main theme, and deters all but the most pedantic fans from pushing further.
People look down on the idea Mushoku Tensei and Ascendance of a Bookworm would have good worldbuilding, because both are isekais, but unlike a lot of later series they aren’t simply copypasting stuff from earlier series, and they got a lot of original ideas.
Take MT for example. (warning: actual spoilers, some heavy ones)
A creator god made six worlds, all of them unstable, and patched them together into a die-shaped one. Then split his soul into six, each becoming a god.
Orsted’s father was the original Dragon God. As he died, the title went to his child. He’s also the grandson of the Human God. The series has a literal god as a villain-then-ally. (told ya I’d mention spoilers!)
You know who is not a god, though? Hitogami! Born in the seventh world, the void formed within the “die”. He killed and usurped the role of the actual Human God (Orsted’s maternal grandpa, BTW). He’s also responsible for the death of the first Dragon God, and the Demon God’s soul splitting into two (one half being murderous). No wonders Orsted hates him so much.
Hitogami always does his shit indirectly, through three or four “apostles” — people whom he shows visions, and automatically trust him. He tried to do it with Rudeus but it backfired, since Rudeus’ soul is not from the six-sided world the “you’ll automatically trust me” gimmick didn’t work.
For example, his intervention against Laplace was to make the Fighting God an apostle and have both fight. You’ve seen that Fighting God; he’s that huge four-arms “WAHAHAHAHA!!!” guy, Badigadi.
The evil half of Laplace fooled the Superd into madness, creating their bad reputation… and the discrimination against people with green hair, like Sylphy. Additionally, people who have green hair are likely to have the Laplace Factor, it’s like the other half of Laplace is slowly tweaking with the inheritance of multiple people, to create a perfect vessel for his reincarnation over the course of millenniums.
There’s at least one religion in the world, the Milis faith, but it’s clear not everyone follows it. It preaches monogamy, while apparently most people are fine with polygamy. The difference in mindset becomes clear near the end of the second season, look at who gets pissed at Rudeus for bringing a second wife home — not his first wife Sylphy, but his sister Norn! Guess who follows the Milis faith? It went worse for Zenith, though, since the guy violating her religious principle was her husband Paul. (And then her son. Poor Zenith. Nobody cares about your faith.)
Time loops are an actual thing in MT, and the reason Orsted has such an odd reaction towards Eris when they just met. Or he says Paul Greyrat was supposed to have two daughters, not a son. There’s also a second “loop chain” where Rudeus visits his past self, to tell him to not trust Hitogami; in that timeline Roxy died, Sylphy left Rudeus, and he never married Eris. He did this because Rudeus and Roxy’s daughter Lara has a pivotal role on defeating Hitogami.
Orsted’s curse doesn’t apply to Rudeus descendants, by the way. Now imagine all three of Rudeus’ wives terrified of Orsted… while their children are like, “dad’s boss! He’s a cool guy and doesn’t afraid of anything”.
I didn’t even scratch the surface of MT’s worldbuilding with the spoilers above, by the way. I could’ve talked about politics of the kingdom of Asura; or what exactly was the Mana Calamity; or the role of Nanahoshi into the story. The more you dig, the more you find, it’s frankly addictive.
Honestly I get that people are turned off by Mushoku Tensei. I think being an isekai is the least of its problems.
I personally really like it but you have to be able to deal with how uncomfortable the MC is.
I think it’s both because I’ve seen people also dissing Ascendance of a Bookworm, simply for being an isekai. Even if its worldbuilding is extremely detailed and well-thought, like:
- magic being seen as a resource, and its ties to the class system
- poor and rich people having completely different mindsets
- Myne’s mindset being alien to both, as an Earthling
- poor people being close-knit communities and suspicious of outsiders
- temples being basically an “out of sight, out of mind” bin for children
- “I have ties to that powerful person!” corruption
- the impact of tech over the social structure
- etc.
And it does those really well IMO.
That said, I do agree with you that Mushoku Tensei also puts people off because of the main character; probably more than for being an isekai.
Quotes of the prologue of the first LN, plus comments
I was a nice guy, but I was on the heavy side, didn’t have good looks going for me, and was in the midst of regretting my entire life.
My brash behavior around the house hadn’t won anyone over. I was the sort of guy who’d bang on the walls and floors to get people’s attention without leaving my room.
He’s a “nice guy”, hated by his looks. Sure. Totally not hated for his behaviour. /s
I’d only been homeless for about three hours. Before that, I’d been the classic, stereotypical, long time shut-in who wasn’t doing anything with his life. And then, all of a sudden, my parents died. Being the shut-in that I was, I obviously didn’t attend the funeral, or the family gathering thereafter.
Lives off his parents, can’t be arsed to attend their funeral.
my older brother, the one with a black belt in karate
If his brother achieved something, it shows the issue is not simply “his family was bad”.
What the hell had I even done wrong? All I did was skip out on our parents’ funeral so I could spank it to uncensored loli porn.
He is not just a paedophile: he’s a paedophile NEET who gives no shit about his family and is completely nonchalant about it.
I’m quoting the LN but the anime does follow fashion.
At least for me it’s clear why Mushoku Tensei does this: it goes out of its way to represent the main character’s start as the rock bottom, because it helps to deliver the theme. MT’s theme is *“persevere and try to become a better person, regardless of your failures; it pays off” — and if even scum like Rudeus can do it, the reader (who’s likely better as a person than Rudeus, it’s hard to not be) can do it too.
His attitude towards his family in the LN volume 12 (second half of the second season) shows that rather well IMO. In no moment the reader is told “Rudeus has changed! He is not the same as that Earthling, he’s a better man!11one”. But his actions show he cares about his isekai family in a way he never did about his Earthling one, and yet they feel natural because he has been becoming a better person over the course of the years.
Spoilers from LN volume 12 / s2 part 2
- Before: bashes floors/walls to communicate because he can’t be arsed to speak with his Japanese parents
- After: loses an arm saving his isekai mother
- Before: busier masturbating than attending his JP parents’ funeral
- After: pays respects to his isekai father’s grave, telling it [the grave] he was an awful son, for doing far less than he did to his JP parents
- Before: shows clear disdain towards his Japanese siblings
- After: cares deeply about Aisha and Norn
- Before: NEET, completely irresponsible, cares only after his computer
- After: raising a family, not just a daughter but also his sisters
From that, you can go two ways, I think. The first one is to accept the MC is shit trying to become less shit, and enjoy the story and worldbuilding. The second one is to skip it; I don’t blame anyone for doing it, if they want a more relatable main character, I think different people want different stuff and that’s completely fine.
Additionally there’s a third way: some people instead lie / bullshit / assume that the work defends NEET-dom, or paedophilia, or not caring about your parents. I think it’s lack of basic media literacy.
Sorry for the wall of text!
More about the “Quotes of the prologue of the first LN, plus comments” spoiler:
spoiler
It’s not just uncensored loli porn. It got censored in the LN from spy cam footage of his niece in the shower (the main reason why his brother gets so violent). In the anime adaptation, you can actually see that they have gone back to that plot point.
The Redundancy Chaper 25 make this canon again in the LN run:
I had brothers and sisters. Brother was married already. And had kids. Two of them. Both girls. They look different from Norm and Asia. They’re Japanese after all, but they shared in their innocence. Brother’s house and my house (that is, our parents) are close by, so they’ll stay over often. Along with his wife and kids. I took advantage of that. Set up a hidden camera in the bath for my niece. In other words, I took voyeur shots.
And here are some more choice quotes from the LN:
Underage. Scornful eyes. Socially awkward. That right there was the trifecta. She was perfect. I wanted her to be my bride.
Of course, it didn’t hurt that my teacher was a junior-high-aged girl at the budding edge of sexual maturity. That was kind of an awesome situation. In my old life, I could have gotten off to that mental image in three pumps.
When talking about Sylphie:
So why couldn’t I just stay here with Sylphie until we were old enough to get by on our own? Sounded pretty good to me. We’d grow up together…and she’d grow up into my perfect woman. Hikaru Genji style, baby! Gweheheh.
Hikaru Genji fell in love with a 10-year-old, kidnapped her when her guardian died, raised her, and then married her.
…Crap! No. No. Bad thoughts. Bad thoughts. What happened to the whole ‘oblivious’ thing, buddy? You’re getting way too far ahead of yourself. Hm. Well, that said… there’s nothing in the rulebook that says an oblivious protagonist can’t brainwash their childhood friend, right? Gah! What am I thinking?! But… ugggh. The girl was only six years old. She was clearly very fond of me, but she wasn’t capable of feeling romantic love yet. So, uh… yeah. Let’s put all that on hold. For how long, though? Now that was the question. Did I need to wait until she turned ten? Fifteen? Even older…? What if she ended up hating me for wasting her time? Her affection meter was at max for now, but there was no guarantee it would stay that way forever. Could I live with myself if it dropped to zero? No. Hell no!!! I’m a man who knows my limits, damn it! Seriously, she’s so soft and warm and fluffy! And she smells so freakin’ good! She’s baring her soul to me right now, and I’m supposed to just sit here slack-jawed?! That’s so messed up! We both know how we feel, so we should just take this to the next level! Why force myself to waste precious time? Why not just admit I made the wrong call?! That does it. I’ve decided! I’ll make her into my perfect girl! I’m…I’m oblivious no more, Sylphieeee!
About the mental age argument you sometimes hear people make to excuse his actions:
I had to keep in mind that, while I might have been a jobless high-school dropout, I also had the mental age of a person in his midthirties. I could do this!
But now I knew all of my missteps. With all the knowledge and experience from my past life, I could finally do it. I could finally live life right.
A man more than a decade my junior had gotten married, had a kid, and was now struggling with how to raise him. Given my thirty-four-year-history of indolent joblessness, you wouldn’t think I’d be able to outdo him at much of anything.
And in LN3 the Man God is directly addressing his mental image of himself:
Well it’s not just a dream. I’m speaking directly into your mind right now. Hard to believe your mental image of yourself is so different from your body…
Some more quotes from later on when he is supposedly be all changed:
Don’t tell me this guy is a true-born lolicon who somehow witnessed Julie doing something perverted. I mean, the two of us might have something in common then, but I definitely don’t want him coming anywhere near my daughters in that case.
That’s from volume 18.
Basically, there is a lot of mental gymnastics going on with a lot of people to paint Rudeus as anything other than a pedophile.
Additionally there’s a third way: some people instead lie / bullshit / assume that the work defends NEET-dom, or paedophilia, or not caring about your parents. I think it’s lack of basic media literacy.
I believe in option 3.5: there are too many instances (even outside MC’s actions) in the series where terrible behaviour is normalised, hand-waved, or trivialised as funny, to be just there to build character. Look at Rudeus’ father as an example outside of MC. While MT might not necessarily be a work to defend neets, pedos, cheaters, etc., it is clearly written in a way so that it doesn’t step on those people’s toes. Are they the sole target audience? No, but they are a large part of it.
I’ve also seen an interesting discussion about how much of the author’s personality is reflected in their works.
It’s not just uncensored loli porn. It got censored in the LN from spy cam footage of his niece in the shower (the main reason why his brother gets so violent).
[Rudeus on Sylphy and Roxy]
The anime and WN are a bit more explicit on that, but even the LN is crystal clear on Rudeus being a paedophile. And I think the folks doing mental gymnastics to claim otherwise also lack basic media literacy, just like I criticised the “third way” ones.
In the meantime I find your “option 3.5” fairly reasonable. It’s completely fine to criticise the work for not doing a good job of calling out shitty behaviour, specially in the light of its theme.
Rudeus does mention once that Paul (isekai father) is scum, and that’s why they understand each other, but… that’s it. In the meantime Paul cheats on Zenith (who’s monogamous) with Lilia (who’s employed by Paul, so Paul is in a position of power over her), and gets away with it.
I’ve also seen an interesting discussion about how much of the author’s personality is reflected in their works.
It’s somewhat clear for me that Magonote doesn’t really care too much about social causes, such as the role of women in society. And that he caves in to readers’ pressure a bit too easily. But past that, I don’t know, really.
Rudeus does mention once that Paul (isekai father) is scum, and that’s why they understand each other, but… that’s it. In the meantime Paul cheats on Zenith (who’s monogamous) with Lilia (who’s employed by Paul, so Paul is in a position of power over her), and gets away with it.
That part also gets a bit deeper and more disturbing in the WN (I’m not sure if the LN has cut that part or not):
WN spoiler
In the WN Paul rapes Lilia, a fellow student, in the academy and gets kicked out as a consequence. He then starts a family with Zenith. Lilia, on the other hand, somehow did fall in love with her rapist and seeks him out to insert herself into his family, where she knowingly creates a situation where Paul would cheat with her (leaves the door a slit open while masturbating). Once Zenith finds out, they enter the harem route, with the consequences being that Paul has to sit on the floor in the hallway. I remember this written in a way that made it sound like it was slapstick (haha, look at that pitiful man that has to sit on the floor haha).
I’m not a prude. Rape happens. Cheating happens, and harem routes are an anime staple. The problem I have with Paul’s story is the message between the lines. If you rape a girl, she will fall in love with you. If you cheat on your wife or are a home wrecker, you will enter the harem route, where everyone is happy. And all that without any bad consequences for the bad behavior. And this was something I’ve seen in all aspects of the series throughout. Sure, bad things happen to people, but it’s as a consequence of unrelated factors instead of their shitty behavior (i.e. the displacement is bad for Paul, but it’s not happening because of his raping and cheating, etc.).
In earlier discussions about this, I’ve seen the argument that it is just realistic and that bad actions don’t necessarily come with bad consequences in reality. And while this is infuriatingly true and can’t really be argued against, it still rubs me the wrong way in entertainment, even more so than MC being MC.
I don’t get why people are still hyping Mushoku Tensei, not a fan of media that glorifies or supports pedophilia
It doesn’t? Even if you want to equivocate loli and pedophilia, it’s still portrayed as bad at every turn from what i remember.
Ah yes, so bad that the bad character marries someone he groomed, someone he raped, and someone who is described to look like a child.
The show has been written to glorify Rudeus’ negative behaviour. In the beginning he’s already a repulsive person, but there was potential for a growth arc. And yet, he doesn’t. Sure, the show addresses some topics like ED for him to deal with and learn from, but it feels quite limp-wristed - he grows and learns from things that negatively affect himself, not from things that negatively affect others. For example, when finally Rudeus is poised to understand the implications of his actions and the impact he has on other people, he’s suddenly just groping the redheaded kid. Rudeus dealing with depression could have been poignant, yet again - panties.
Loli in and of itself is kinda grey area, and as such is tolerable in media. But the combination of Loli with other factors pushes it into the negative. Add on Rudeus being depicted as a good guy during all of this, and it’s clear that it’s a power fantasy isekai where the repulsive MC might struggle, but gets a happy ending nevertheless. Rudeus might be depicted as feeling bad/apologetic for being creepy, yet he doesn’t change. What do you mean he gets to walk free by perving over a figurine with the guard. Or that Eris’ father wanted to tie her up with Rudy’s bed to gain political standing.
So in short, it was depicted bad in the same way that someone play fighting might go “staahp, noooo”.
Spy X Family is a good one too
