Bazzite has a very simple process for installing software that isn’t on Flatpak: You spin up a virtual machine running a better distro and install it there
You can just use
rpm-ostreeif you really need something as a system package. Otherwise toolbx or distrobox if it’s not available as a flatpak. None of these are virtual machines
I’m a noob, and I thought Bazzite would be simpler, but when I had an issue (monitor going black under heavy load), I couldn’t solve the problem because of the immutable OS. I went around in circles with Google and ChatGPT, and couldn’t get it to work.
The discord is usually really helpful.
echo "alias apt='sudo rpm-ostree'" > .bashrcLMAO.
So I realize this is a meme community but why not, its on topic:
… How is one supposed to install say, I2P, I2PD … on Bazzite?
I have tried the flatpak but it doesn’t work properly because it only installs at the user level via the app store/flatpak… not the system level.
I have tried to figure out how to set it up in a distro box and am apparently too stupid to figure this out.
I am also apparently too stupid to figure out which of the like 8 different kinds of ports I2P uses for one thing or another… I actually need to forward in my router.
help plz
Yes, I have read the wiki.
As I said, flatpak no worky because you don’t have a system level install option.
Flatseal might help, but I do not know what I’d have to custom configure.
Ujust has no helper commands for i2p.
Homebrew might help for setting up the daemon, but i wouldn’t know how to connect it properly to a firefox or librewolf container tab, within bazzite.
… Quadlet.
Ok. This didn’t exist the last time I looked at the wiki a couple months ago, goddamnit.
I2P does have a docker set up guide… this might actually work, if it can direcrtly fuck with bazzite’s systemctl.
That being said: I have never use cli docker before so… wheee!
Uh other than that:
Distrobox is basically a very fancy docker container… maybe if I set up a whole distro, with I2P, and its own version of ffox, lwolf… that would work?
…afaik there is no official i2p appimage, and even if there was, its containerized, same problem as a flatpak.
… and finally, rpm ostree, the big no no… yeah, there is no official .rpm for i2p.
… I… guess… i could set up vanilla fedora… in distrobox… and try to compile it from source… and then… either install that rpm in the fedora-distrobox… or… bazzite itself?
… its mid night, im going to bed rofl.
Isn’t i2p in the repos?
There is an unofficial build in COPR, maintained by… some random person? …but nothing mainline.
And its instructions tell you to install with dnf, which i think at this point is literally disabled by Bazzite… because they rely on rpm-ostree, and if you muck about with rpm-ostree, you can run into dependency conflict hell.
But at the same time, i2p needs to be able to directly mess with systemctl… which… as far as I can tell… can’t be done by having i2p installed in some kind of container… because the entire point of a container… is to isolate the core system.
Why does it need systemctl?
There are official container images that you could use. If all else fails you could set it up in a VM.
What about java? I saw on the website that they provide java program.
Bazzite does not come with java.
As… far as I am aware… you cannot install Java via flatpak or appimage or any other methods Bazzite says are safe to install things by/with.
To install java, in Fedora, you are told to use dnf, but Bazzite has disabled dnf because they use rpm-ostree to maintain a controlled and static core os.
To install java using rpm-ostree would likely lead to dependency conflict hell, and destabilize Bazzite… because the entire point of Bazzite is to enforce specific rpm-ostree build recipes, to provide maximum stability for officially supported stuff.
You could potentially set up distrobox container, set up java there, install i2p in the container… but that container is isolated from messing with systemctl, which i2p must do (as far as I can tell?) to actually function properly… so this also seems like it would not work.
I’ve not used i2p but I’ve had to mess with a lot of other random weird tools under bazzite. I’d suggest installing it in a distrobox. There is a command for linking programs from your host into the distrobox and then exposing them back to the host. I forget the exact syntax but I used it for vscode and intellij and it was really straight forward and worked well. I don’t see why it wouldn’t work with i2p and Firefox.
Can you experiment and see if
rpm-ostreewill lead to destabilization? If nothing else works this is IMO your best shot other than building from source to use inrpm-ostree.I can… and I have… and this has resulted in destabilzation.
… This is why I am asking for help, if anyone has figured this out… and why I am not asking for permission to continue to flail about ineffectively.
As far as I can tell, as ludicrous as it seems… setting up a distrobox with an actual mainline fedora build, then configuring it as a dev enviroment, then building an rpm package for i2p, from source inside this container… and then installing that static rpm into actual Bazzite OS…
That would probably at least be more stable for Bazzite as a whole, just feeding it a single, extra, static package, as compared to source dependency hell…
But I have no idea if I2P would… actually compile correctly… and… work.
Although, I have managed to build Godot, a few versions ago, doing this, just as an experiment… and it … seemed to… mostly work?
???
There were lots of fun unique error messages in the console that just did not exist anywhere else online.
Create debian lxc contairlner, install docker inside of that then install distrobox inside that
please excuse me while my head implodes inside of my head imploding inside of my head imploding
Easier than learning what a flatpack is and probably uses less ressources while being more reliable and faster and not crashing for reasons that will eat your entire weekend to solve.
Oh how I wish there was some distro that was just debian based, but preconfigured to work on a handheld PC, not sanboxed and containerized to all hell.
The entire design paradigm of Bazzite is ‘sandbox the custom core fedora architecture, give the users a milliom kinds of containers for everything else, so they won’t break the custom core architecture’.
Bazzite has a very simple process for installing software that isn’t on Flatpak: You spin up a virtual machine running a better distro and install it there
Seems like someone didn’t bother reading any of the documentation… There are like 4 alternative ways to do it, including using apt (in a distrobox).
‘Car’ should have been painted over with white instead of black. The other text already has a white outline. This is hard to read.
They’re on Bazzite so maybe they only had black installed
Me 10 years ago after deciding to go into the deepend a bit to learn Linux and installing Slackware.
yt-dlp AND btop isnt on the default app store on Bazzite. Im sure theres a way to get them installed, but it was rather annoying playing my game, watching a video on the side, finding a video that looks worth keeping, and i cant download it
yt-dlp works just fine for me on bazzite. I think I just use the app image? I even made an alias for it in my bashrc file so I only need to type “yt”.
Some other tips: play around with BoxBuddy (distrobox) for a bit if you haven’t yet.
You can use apt if you want, just create a Debian distrobox. BoxBuddy allows you to easily create shortcuts to apps installed in distroboxes to run them directly on your host system. So once you create it you never have to mess with the box again if you don’t want to.
I came from EndeavourOS, so I just made an Arch distrobox that I can use to get packages from the AUR.
“ujust update” (or the bazzite system updater thing) command will update all of your distrobox images (and any apps installed on them) as part of the process. And if you mess something up, or decide you don’t want it, you just delete the distrobox.
It’s actually pretty easy, and I think it’s cool that your distro doesn’t really matter anymore.
Ive only played with Bazzite for 2 days now. (Got a 2nd hand keayboard last year August. Finally changed the RGB with Bazzite and its OpenRPG tool). If you can set up Desktop mode as the default boot, then it is probably the best distro to reccomend to new users.
I do have Arch as my main OS installed on another drive, and that does everything else i need.
It’s good for new users. But it should be noted that does not mean that power users and tinkerers wouldn’t also like it.
I tinkered around and made an Arch install for myself last year, until I realized that it was just turning into Bazzite but with extra steps, so I went back to Bazzite.
Yeah, things are different on Bazzite. You can install things via homebrew as well. For yt-dlp use
brew install yt-dlp(same command for btop). If something isn’t on homebrew too, there is a distrobox option. If you get used to AUR, Bazzite can be a little tedious.If you get used to AUR, Bazzite can be a little tedious.
I just use my Arch distrobox to access AUR if I need to (though I don’t think I’ve had to).
rpm-ostree is an adjustment, but now that I understand it more and know all of my options for installing packages, I think it’s fantastic.
The devs recommend against using rpm-ostree but yeah, distrobox is limitless. It’s just doing things different way. I also like how Bazzite (or Aurora) adds a program as a menu shortcut installed via distrobox, pretty convenient.
I just mean learning how the ostree shit works in general for the most part. For pinning images and learning how to rollback if needed, etc.
I try not to install things using rpm-ostree unless absolutely necessary.
Edit: I probably should have just said “ostree” in the original comment.
You most likely won’t need it since there is distrobox option.
I had to install coolercontrol that way. Unless that was a ujust command, I forget.
Bazzite is the better distro because you install things in a distrobox. Muck around, break things in there, but your main distro stays safe, secure and stable.
That is true, but for embedded development it sucks because of specialty drivers, access to dbus, udev rules, etc… And distrobox with vscodium or code oss has some big big slowdowns that I can’t figure out.
Saleae software simply won’t work consistently in distrobox, for example. Luckily they have an app image so I could just install it there and set a few settings and now it works well. Sigrok Pulseview is better but needs a few not-dependency packages to work around it.
There is some weirdness to atomic distros and bazzite, but I am pretty happy with it!
Until the keys change. And you spend forever wondering why it updates every day only to realize it was the same update over and over and over, and the only way they announce they broke things is a GitHub issue.
I love Bazzite, daily it on my gaming PC. But imutable distros do have challenges, and installing non-standard software is defintlately one of them.
They also announced it on their discord server, fyi.
Until the keys change. And you spend forever wondering why it updates every day only to realize it was the same update over and over and over, and the only way they announce they broke things is a GitHub issue.
Keys for what? Bazzite? When did this happen?
Yes, this did happen, but also, they fixed it, and owned up to and totally explained their mistake.
Hmmm. I use QubesOS mainly for the ability to have a separate VM for different things that I can muck around in and not break shit. Does bazzite offer a similar experience?
You don’t run a VM for everything with Bazzite, Distrobox is more like Flatpak or WSL in that regard.
It also isn’t much more secure, it’s just that everything is a bit more contained and comes with their own dependencies.
So it’s kinda like a docker container its got its own filesystem and root runtime but not its own kernel?
Distrobox is just a set of shell scripts that controlls Podman under the hood. Not only is it like docker, it literally uses the same container format (ContainerD).
Huh the more u know lol
Eh, it’s fedora under the hood with SELinux enabled, and immutable, better than most security wise, I didn’t say much more.
I replied to @muntedcrocodile@lemm.ee and understood the question like “Is distrobox as secure as QubesOS?”, which I replied with “No”.
I’d say Fedora Atomic is definitely a bit more secure than other distros (e.g. Ubuntu, regular Fedora, etc.) for reasons you mentioned, but if you are a user that thinks that only Qubes offers the security you need, than there’s no alternative.
I can recommend you Secureblue tho as a good middle ground.
It’s Fedora Atomic, but hardened, a bit like GrapheneOS. Still viable for comfortable everyday use, but much more secure.I replied to @muntedcrocodile@lemm.ee and understood the question like “Is distrobox as secure as QubesOS?”, which I replied with “No”.
Ahh, fair cop. Good point on Secureblue, but my threat model doesn’t take me there.
As a Bazzite fan, lmao. True
yeah it’s
rpm-ostree install <pkg>what’s the big deal
Bazzite docs repeatedly say ‘do not do that, it will lead to system instability as we update and improve the feature set of our custom rpm-ostree that is the backbone and fundamental core of what Bazzite is.’
It is supposed to be a static, locked down, readonly core OS, just like SteamOS.
Its just based on fedora instead of arch, and has a bunch of other customizations and tweaks and preconfigured apps and helper tools.
fair point
https://docs.bazzite.gg/Installing_and_Managing_Software/rpm-ostree/
so you have to be careful what you add to your base; preferably just self-contained tools that will not interfere with the stability of the system, use distrobox or other container to create larger more sophisticated environments
i used it for an icon theme, amd gpu info tool, android cli tools. they all come from the fedora repos so play nice with the base and i haven’t run into update issues mentioned in the info page
it’s also very easy to
rpm-ostree resetif you do, so it has that safety net
Not really though… Not gonna be that annoying guy and repeat what I and others have said elsewhere in the thread, but you should read some of the replies here.
It would be DNF in this case
This made me lol today, thank you
its in the ubuntu or debian toolbox. distrobox is pretty freaking awesome.
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I love bazzite for handheld consoles but before I install it on my desktop there needs to be version based on ordinary ‘non-immutable’ fedora kde. That being said, immutable distros are more stable
I’ve been using it on my laptop for over 6 months now and it has been fantastic.
I mean, if you’re really hardcore, you can build your own immutable distro image using the distro you want… but that’s way above my paygrade. I don’t think it’s that difficult, just something I have no intention of learning.
Nobara
Nobara’s handheld … ‘edition’, is a very, very rough ride in basic usability compared to Bazzite.
I tried it a month or so back, and it is just constantly asking for admin passwords to re-enable the basic gamescope overlay whenever you do amything to the system.
It asks you… to type in a password… after gamescope has been disabled… which means you have no keyboard.
A workaround to this is to hold the steam button on a deck and go into big picture mode, then use the joycons and buttons to kill steam, then you restart steam, then you can now type in the password.
… But you will have to repeat this process over and over and over again while in desktop mode.
This is what I would call unusable as a handheld PC OS. GE has to… actually figure out how to make it work when it is just a handheld, otherwise, you do not have a handheld OS.
Nobara promised me a nice dinner and then punched me in the taint
Usually need to pay extra for that
Unlikely to happen. Not only is all their build tooling etc. made for immutable distros (and they have a lot of other ones besides Bazzite), but it would also mean throwing away the biggest advantages for little gain.
What’s your problem with the image based OS?
If there’s really anything you need, you can layer it or build your own image quite easily.
I switched from Bazzite to Garuda to get away from it being immutable. It’s been great.
So, Nobara?
I would have stuck with Nobara, which is the first Linux distro I really tried, but it was maintained by one person and eventually they’re going to get burned out or worse. I figured it would be better to just go with a distro that had a whole team working on it.
