Ah yes, the very unbiased and fair comparison between murder and podcast incels. There are no real issues that men are facing…
I don’t understand why people can’t support women while supporting men too. I can. You can do too. It is not women vs men. It is tradition/sexism vs individual freedom/respect.
On the one hand, I agree. On the other hand, most men do not understand that to be a woman means constantly being in danger.
“But not all men are-” I know. Everyone knows. There’s good people of every gender, that’s not in question. The problem is that people keep saying “Not all men” in direct response to women expressing that they don’t feel safe. Same energy as telling a black person “All lives matter”.
There’s the men this meme is about, and there’s the men this meme is for, and the venn diagram is two separate circles. The assholes with the podcasts aren’t going to understand, because they’re the problem. They think that by being nice they’re entitled to sex, and then get vindictive when no sex. Most everyone else doesn’t understand because the thought of being such a douch doesn’t occur to them.
While it’s not an “excuse”, I think the “explanation” tends to be that speech from Nick in Zootopia: If people are going to regard you as shifty and untrustworthy, why bother being anything else.
Like I said, not a valid reason, but I do see how that toxic manosphere grows through fear.
The problem is that people keep saying “Not all men” in direct response to women expressing that they don’t feel safe. Same energy as telling a black person “All lives matter”.
I don’t think this is entirely accurate. The equivalent of an “all lives matter” person is a “men have issues too” person, not a “not all men” person. The first two are from people taking issue with advocacy for one group (black people; women) because they see it as exclusionary of or harmful to their group (white people; men)*. In contrast, “not all men” people are responding to a percieved attack directed at them, not just to being excluded from targeted advocacy. Subtly but meaningfully different, imo.
* Technically non-black people and non-women, I suppose? But this is the general pattern I’ve recognized.
The worst part… it works. E.g. on me, and i know. It is difficult to see these kind of posts, which are clearly misandry, and then hear people deny the trend for misandry, especially online.
OBVIOUSLY there is a shit tonne of misogyny, especially online and that is a big problem. But we shouldn’t ignore the trend to misandry. It is not a competition and we fight against misogyny better if we fight sexism in general, I believe.
But the posts make me feel like a shocking amount of people are not against sexism but just misogyny. How am I supposed to feel like those are not my enemy when I am opposed to sexism?
Then I spend time with the people that I love and I am good again but… it is fucking poison.
But with this specific issue, the most efficient solution is to help women. Women are being mean to the man community because the man community is harming women. There’s no solution that will get women to be nicer to your community more efficiently than getting your community to be nicer to women.
I disagree, because your suggestion is treating a symptom. The cause-- the structures and incentives causing the divide in the first place-- would remain, and you will never resolve all the symptoms until the cause is resolved. Trying to resolve every symptom first would result in a neverending battle.
I can’t believe I’m about to defend grail, but i this thread they’re objectively correct and you’re not. Worse still, you’re being a douch about it. Stop it.
While I do agree with your sentiment I think its critical we work thru the issue so the rich can’t use it against us. Somehow get to an understanding that men and women face issues, both should be supported.
There’s still too many men who can’t understand why a woman would ever choose the bear.
I mean, I can’t imagine most people being in favor of those things. My idea was more about how online we see missandry and misogyny, even in this comment section. The most well-known recent example was the bear.
Just that we should try to work through our divides. Women vs men. Urban vs rural. Etc. Because they’re easy distractions.
Ah yes, the very unbiased and fair comparison between murder and podcast incels. There are no real issues that men are facing…
I don’t understand why people can’t support women while supporting men too. I can. You can do too. It is not women vs men. It is tradition/sexism vs individual freedom/respect.
On the one hand, I agree. On the other hand, most men do not understand that to be a woman means constantly being in danger.
“But not all men are-” I know. Everyone knows. There’s good people of every gender, that’s not in question. The problem is that people keep saying “Not all men” in direct response to women expressing that they don’t feel safe. Same energy as telling a black person “All lives matter”.
There’s the men this meme is about, and there’s the men this meme is for, and the venn diagram is two separate circles. The assholes with the podcasts aren’t going to understand, because they’re the problem. They think that by being nice they’re entitled to sex, and then get vindictive when no sex. Most everyone else doesn’t understand because the thought of being such a douch doesn’t occur to them.
While it’s not an “excuse”, I think the “explanation” tends to be that speech from Nick in Zootopia: If people are going to regard you as shifty and untrustworthy, why bother being anything else.
Like I said, not a valid reason, but I do see how that toxic manosphere grows through fear.
I’m sure that’s a significant part of it too
I don’t think this is entirely accurate. The equivalent of an “all lives matter” person is a “men have issues too” person, not a “not all men” person. The first two are from people taking issue with advocacy for one group (black people; women) because they see it as exclusionary of or harmful to their group (white people; men)*. In contrast, “not all men” people are responding to a percieved attack directed at them, not just to being excluded from targeted advocacy. Subtly but meaningfully different, imo.
* Technically non-black people and non-women, I suppose? But this is the general pattern I’ve recognized.
My analogy isn’t perfect, but I think it holds up well enough to make my point.
Woman: “I’d like to not be sexually harassed when I go out in public.”
Man: “I feel personally attacked by this statement.”
Black person: “I’d like to not be killed by a cop today.”
White person: “I feel personally attacked by this statement.”
It’s good enough to make the point, but inaccuracies add up, so I always try to correct the ones I percieve, however small.
that’s fair
I hate these kinds of posts too. All they do is promote division in these times we have to stick together against the billionaires
The worst part… it works. E.g. on me, and i know. It is difficult to see these kind of posts, which are clearly misandry, and then hear people deny the trend for misandry, especially online.
OBVIOUSLY there is a shit tonne of misogyny, especially online and that is a big problem. But we shouldn’t ignore the trend to misandry. It is not a competition and we fight against misogyny better if we fight sexism in general, I believe.
But the posts make me feel like a shocking amount of people are not against sexism but just misogyny. How am I supposed to feel like those are not my enemy when I am opposed to sexism?
Then I spend time with the people that I love and I am good again but… it is fucking poison.
This post still isn’t at bad as a roofie.
We can start working on posts like this once we’ve solved the roofie problem.
A roofie isn’t as bad as the bombing of schoolchildren. We can start working on roofing until we’ve solved the warcrime problem.
How can we not work on both at the same time again?
Did you even read the comment you replied to?
We can only ever work on one issue at once
That’s usually not true.
But with this specific issue, the most efficient solution is to help women. Women are being mean to the man community because the man community is harming women. There’s no solution that will get women to be nicer to your community more efficiently than getting your community to be nicer to women.
I disagree, because your suggestion is treating a symptom. The cause-- the structures and incentives causing the divide in the first place-- would remain, and you will never resolve all the symptoms until the cause is resolved. Trying to resolve every symptom first would result in a neverending battle.
What counts as “solved”? What are the goalposts, and who gets to judge those?
Why is roofying bad? She won’t remember it, and that’s good enough for women when they circumcise their infant boys.
Circumcision is actually horrible. My partner is still really sad it was circumcised even after all those years.
Circumcision doesn’t just affect men. People of all genders are circumcised and suffer for it. So please don’t make light of circumcision.
Honestly you probably shouldn’t start a “Who can make the most braindead stupid argument” competition if you can’t handle losing, Grail.
I agree, they definitely lost the “Who can make the most braindead stupid argument” competition…congrats on your big win 🤣🤣🤣
Thank me for my service o7
I can’t believe I’m about to defend grail, but i this thread they’re objectively correct and you’re not. Worse still, you’re being a douch about it. Stop it.
I was circumcised so I’m allowed to like how the chinese can throw cats at their enemies.
Delusionposting contender 2026
While I do agree with your sentiment I think its critical we work thru the issue so the rich can’t use it against us. Somehow get to an understanding that men and women face issues, both should be supported.
There’s still too many men who can’t understand why a woman would ever choose the bear.
Except polling on most issues regarding women are positive. No one is favor of more rape, lower wages, and sexual harassment.
That being said the bear analogy pisses me off
I mean, I can’t imagine most people being in favor of those things. My idea was more about how online we see missandry and misogyny, even in this comment section. The most well-known recent example was the bear.
Just that we should try to work through our divides. Women vs men. Urban vs rural. Etc. Because they’re easy distractions.
100% agreed. I just hold lemmy in a higher regard because I see less divisiveness here vs other social media and it want to keep it that way