Six days ago, upgradeable laptop maker Framework tried to convince its fractious user community to live in a “big tent” after a Debian developer objected to the company’s sponsorship of Hyprland and its social media promotion of Omarchy, with both projects associated with politically polarizing viewpoints.
Antoine Beaupré, aka anarcat, demanded that Framework clarify its political position with regard to these two projects.
Hyprland, a Wayland compositor, is led by a “toxic and hateful community,” Beaupré observed, and Omarchy, a Linux distribution, comes from David Heinemeier Hansson (aka DHH), a controversial figure in the Ruby and Linux communities.
Context for those OOTL
DHH Is Way Worse Than I Thought
DHH: “London is no longer the city I was infatuated with in the late ’90s and early 2000s. Chiefly because it’s no longer full of native Brits. In 2000, more than sixty percent of the city were native Brits. By 2024, that had dropped to about a third. A statistic as evident as day when you walk the streets of London now.”
Author: It turns out that when DHH says “native Brits”, he’s specifically referring to white Brits. That’s why it’s “a statistic as clear as day when you walk the streets of London”: it’s his coy way of saying that too many of the 59% of Londoners born and raised in the UK are not white.
So if David means “white Brits”, why doesn’t he just say that? Why bother with the innuendo Because complaining that there aren’t enough white people sounds weird and racist! David bristles at that label, but there’s a reason he’s hiding behind euphemisms rather than just saying what he means. Most people don’t go around thinking “boy, all these Black and Asian people make this city so much worse.”
Well, u should watch Kurt Caz on youtube. Checkout London, Barcelona, Brussel. Then tell me that there isn’t a problem going on. Racism is not to be defended, but you can’t just call everything racism when countries are going to shit.
Already DHH take it easy.
Last I visited, Barcelona was beautiful and the people living there adored it. London isn’t terrible either, although housing is extortionate due to ‘investors’ and landlords
But is the reason these countries are “going to shit” race related? And what exactly does “going to shit” mean?
Since you referenced Kurt Caz, a notorious racist and xenophobe, I’m guessing your answer is yes and “less white”, but us adults in the room wonder about the real issues and their causes.
“Us adults” lol. Look at crime statistics. A certain minority causes a disproportionate amount of the crimes. Look I’m not white myself, and not all immigrants are bad. But lately EU has had a lot of problems because of refugees and migration. Housing shortages, increase in crime. It isn’t just black and white. There is more nuance to it than too far right and being racist, and being too far left and ignoring that there are problems caused.
As for Kurt I only know him walking around in favelas hahah, so whoops not the best example. But his videos do show the growing problems in cities
Given you’re regurgitating bullshit that could be disproven by a child, yeah, you’re not an an adult.
You are being fed BS. There are no crime statistics that show this once you actually look at the data in an unbiased way, but there are a lot of people which present the data in ways that are easy to misunderstand (on purpose).
Possibly, no one is immune to propaganda. And I might be completely off by linking it to increase in migrations etc. But it’s getting less appealing to be walking around alone at night in the major European Cities.
Why less appealing? There is no increase in crime or anything else that makes that less appealing (other than that a lot of small shops closed during the pandemic or are being priced out by real-estate speculators), you really need to stop believing the lies these social media influencers feed you.
“You can’t call everything racism!”
looks inside
Blatant Racism
mfw europeans are hitlerite
Grouping a whole folk as hitlerite, that’s quite hypocritical good sir
you had no problem grouping a whole folk as problematic but suddenly when its about you now you have a problem with it?
No i dont and just because my opinions are stupid that shouldn’t mean that you can be hypocritical. I am stupid and know it, but you pointing out blame and doing it yourself is just funny
I am stupid and I know it
Then why are you expecting me to be any better if you don’t want to stop yourself here and begin the introspection?
Somehow you want people to read your arguments and change their opinion but when people ask you to do the same you just declare you are stupid and refuse to do the very thing that you expect others to do?
correct, if u want to take the moral highground u can’t be contradicting urself. Im not here to convince anyone, besides why would i document my whole introspection here? Maybe my opinion has changed after engaging on this post. That’s what internet forums are for, u say stupid stuff then someone corrects u and u can adjust your views. No need to type it out, unless u want to be my therapist
This definitely had a negative impact on my view of framework, can’t say I’d buy from them again.
Same. Considering sending an email to tell them this.
Already have, along with my concerns about the outsized money going to essentially DHH events.
Might even sell my FW, I don’t think I want to be associated with the brand at all.
Which brands are acceptable to be associated with?
(I don’t own one, and I’m not familiar with what other brands are available these days.)
I’ll admit I’m not up to date on the hyprland/vaxry lore – but I don’t understand the level of outrage based on this article…
I’m also not sure why the sponsorship of a software project is necessarily being treated as a 100% endorsement of both the maintainers and their alleged views.
I’m also not sure if infighting and purity testing will help the movement(s) right now. Once it’s the norm, sure, but it’s still a relatively fringe movement within the industry.
Edit (2025-10-15@20:14): At the time of writing my comment, I was both unaware (and uninformed) on the DHH side of this topic. While I still think the level of outrage is maybe a melodramatic, the push back seems more warranted than it initially seemed to me. I still don’t know much about DHH beyond Rails (and even then, not much); but from what I’ve seen since my comment, the response is more understandable.
Most of the discourse was about Omarchy/DHH, not just Hyprland, though that was a part of it. It is not purity testing to block people who don’t work well with others or are hateful like DHH from a community. If you want to bring people who want us dead into a community then everyone else is going to leave
The main problem is
- Np contributed to and glazes Omarchy
- People wonder why DHH was sponsored with hardware
- Generic response about “big tent” ideology to include everyone - including racists and transphobes like DHH
- People are upset because they don’t want to be in a Nazi Bar
- NP makes twitter post about how people want to ascribe values to him he doesn’t hold, that he’s pro immigrant and pro lgbt
- Np responds in forum thread that they reviewed hyprland and determined that theyd improved their moderation and were ok to sponsor (monetarily)
- Framework responds they’ll make a blog post clarifying their sponsorships
- Blog post coincidentally excludes omarchy
- People question it and basically just get a “we will get that updated” response
- I still dont see it there
You cant claim to be pro immigrant and pro lgbt when you actively invite white supremacists and transphobes into the community and then try to avoid responsibility for that by not commenting or not retracting support or not clarifying how you’d avoid it going forward
The project may not be political (it is) but the people who use and support the project definitely are. If you want to kick out the community by inviting Nazis, then all that will be left once those people leave will be nazis. And if you knowingly collaborate with Nazis, you are a nazi.
If we deleted everything written by insufficiently pure developers, we wouldn’t have a Linux desktop. Especially if we count the ones that were smart enough to not bring up anything political in public.
Not a fan of DHH, but then you delete Rails then there’s no GitHub, GitLab, Mastodon, and many many other things given how popular Rails is, and that’s just that one guy.
If you include all the sketchy stuff that happens in the supply chain mining the minerals, processing, assembly all the way up to the final computer product, you just can’t morally justify supporting any manufacturer either.
This really doesn’t do anything useful other than feeling good to not support one of those guys. If anything it just adds extra political drama that feeds into a much bigger worldwide division problem.
Yeah good luck with that. The righteous left doesn’t want empathetic coexistence with alternative views any more than the immoral right does.
DHH has fairly normal right wing views. Nobody has been able to point me to anything so objectionable that should mean he is excluded from the community. The worst I could find is that he thinks it would be better if London was predominantly native British, which I don’t think is an out-there idea.
These inclusive communities have to learn to be more actually inclusive. It’s ok to ban him if he’s harassing people due to their political views in the Ruby community, but it looks like all he did was post some moderately right-wing views on his blog.
Not going to hold my breath though.
I don’t know anything about the Hyprland guy but I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s a similar story.
The worst I could find is that he thinks it would be better if London was predominantly native British, which I don’t think is an out-there idea.
If that doesn’t sound racist to you, I have bad news for you.
No I don’t think it’s racist to want to live in a city that is predominantly occupied by similar people to you. I think his stats are wrong - London is still mostly British people (at least it was when I last went). But imagine if it was like 95% Indian people. That would a huge change and a big cultural shift and yes I think it’s ok to object to that with instantly becoming racist.
https://jakelazaroff.com/words/dhh-is-way-worse-than-i-thought/
If ethnic cleansing constitutes “fairly normal right-wing views,” then right wingers have no place in polite, civil society because they support a violent, genocidal ideology bent on destroying Western Civilization. How can we have empathetic coexistence, for example, in a government that forcably disappears legal non-white immigrants and sends them to labor camps via federally funded masked thugs operating in unmarked vans? How can anyone peacefully coexist with a group that only wants to make space in society for white Americans and is willing to achieve those ends violently and extralegally?
It didn’t used to be this way. Right-wingers can go back to peaceful coexistence when they put aside the supremacist and nationalist viewpoints and return to advocating for low taxes and small government without excluding entire groups of people. But make no mistake, the Right – the intolerant ones – have to change first. The fact that you think that this is “normal” is a chilling indictment of modern society. At this rate, in 10 years you’ll think unelected leaders, concentration camps and death by firing squad is “normal” too.
I merely want to hang black people from trees while wearing a white robe! Why does THE LEFT have to be so intolerant?!
Yeah that would be reasonable if he actually did want to hang black people from trees.
He’s literally spreading “great replacement” rethoric. If you can’t see his racism, I got news for you.
Isn’t “great replacement” a conspiracy that this is a deliberately plan by ethnic minorities? I don’t see him claiming that anywhere.
His numbers are suss but the demographic change in London is dramatic (not as much as he claimed but still). Hopefully Wikipedia is an acceptable source.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ethnic_makeup_of_London_over_time_in_age_groups.gif
So you do think the great replacement is happening, it just isn’t intentional. About those news…
If you’re asking if I know how to read a chart on Wikipedia, the answer is yes.
Ah, is it time to play dumb already?
Given that I’ve never seen you in the Ruby, Rails, or Sinatra communities, I’m going to guess that you aren’t actually part of this conversation. Also, you’ve been fairly obvious in your cryptofascism since this Lemmy instance was set up; you’re one of several users that have ensured that programming.dev has a fairly bad federated reputation, and I’m not sure that anybody really cares whether you’re included given that you don’t appear to publish Free Software or anything else useful.
you’ve been fairly obvious in your cryptofascism
Wow first time I’ve been accused of fascism! Quite riduclous.
