China stole all my family’s serfs 😡😡😡
It’s the Han man’s burden to teach these savages slavery is wrong.
Pretty sure the slaves already knew that slavery was wrong, they just couldn’t do much about it because of the power the Lamas had built up from, you know, exploiting slaves.
Fortunately, when the Chinese overthrew their oppressors, they did not decide to arbitrarily exclude a region of China that had been briefly taken over by a theocracy, because why would they?
If slavery in Tibet is over, the country can be granted independence, no?
If slavery in Tennessee is over, the country can be granted independence, no?
Ah yes, the world famous Tennesseeanianer Freedom Movement.
Maybe Texas would be a better example? There’s definitely Texans who support independence. And Texas has only been part of the US for 180 years, while Tibet has been part of China for at least 300.
Although I certainly heard a fair share of “The South will rise again” and saw a lot of Confederate flags when I lived in Tennessee. Just their version of “Free Tibet,” I suppose.
You are the serfs son.
There aren’t any serfs in China, objectively. And the life expectancy in Tibet has more than doubled since the people were liberated.
40% of China’s mineral resources are in Tibet. I’m sure that had nothing to do with it.
You have been banned from Lemmy.ml!
And lemmygrad. And probably db0.
Is db0 tankie-oriented?
Not fully, but it has some people who’s political opinions are out there. And the admin tends to simp for China themselves.
Will keep that in mind, thank you
China is just a different form of capitalism than other nations but it’s still capitalism. It’s a degenerated workers’ state.
China is the oldest imperial state. Tibet isn’t the only place they occupy and oppress. Uyghurs and other central Asian Turks and of course Mongols on the other end. Although China does have a better claim to the land the Soviets conquered in the Sino-Soviet war.
America and Britain are both older states than China… Even if you want to go with the most racialized ethno-nationalist view of history possible the Han Chinese who are currently on top of the Chinese ethnic pile were the conquered subjects of the Qing Dynasty, who sprang from a different ethnicity called Manchus (from Manchuria, shockingly enough)
That’s just the last dynasty, the various Chinese empires were dominated by a lot of different ethnicities.
China was an empire already when Britain was still pict Country without any anglos or saxons present.
This is about civilization, not ethnicity.
And the Chinese empires collapsed and were reformed as different states ruled by different groups across different regions a dozen times. It’s a nonsense point that posits some weird form of generational sin combined with ethno-nationalist irredentist rhetoric, unironically the same kind of thought that lead Mussolini to claim the holdings of the Romans rightfully belonged to a new Italian Empire.
Or Israel the right to kill any Muslims in Palestine for that matter, paying no mind to the fact that they’re also the descendants of Judea.
If we’re going by this logic then america is older than the majority of european countries but that would make their poor feefees hurt.
It is. A lot of European states are quite young in comparison to the United States. I think many would take exception at being considered the same or directly responsible for some previous form of state, but accept some portion of their culture or heritage.
Americans just don’t have the luxury of overthrowing a monarchy or fundamentally changing form of state since 1776. Our state is still pre-Napoleanic. France has had like what, five republics and constitutions?
Wow…
Learning is fun, isn’t it?
https://quokk.au/c/politicalmemes/p/475141/never-concerned-lmao
But Americans and Canadians criticizing imperialism and conquest is just a political ploy, right? Because you can’t criticize a state for something your nation has done itself.
Or is it suddenly okay for some reason when it’s not about genociding Palestine?
A strawman and whataboutism?
A strong effort, and I appreciate the work you put into that comment.
Truly whattaboutism is when you point out whattaboutism. As for strawman… Lol.
There’s not a fallacy name for just being wrong so I guess I just have to laugh at your attempt to contribute.
That is definitely not how it works.
Only racist people point out racism right?
Who said it was? The obvious sarcasm mocking their claim?
I find it pretty telling that the people trying to argue the point can’t even follow a simple conversation with provided context.
I meant that with sarcasm silly.
you can’t criticize a state for something your nation has done itself
The fuck you can’t. If anything it’s more important for countries to point out when someone else is doing the same thing that they did wrong. Wtf is this whataboutism bullshit?
Maybe you should follow the link to see why I’d say that with obvious sarcasm…
I mean, you don’t even need the link to detect that, but it might help the divergent homies or whatever nonsense you’ve got going on here that makes you ignore literally every other sentence in the comment.
Maybe you should follow the link to see why I’d say that with obvious sarcasm
I picked up on it. And then discarded it, because of who made the comment. The sarcastic reading is a complete reversal of the reasoning in the rest of your comments.
Lmao, what an incredible self dunk from one of Lemmy’s admitted Zionists.
from one of Lemmy’s admitted Zionists.
Sorry what? What comment is that based on?
Hmm, it’s possible I’m getting you mixed up with some other Z-name as you jump in to defend OP’s gatekeeping of criticizing genocide with your self-admitted ignorant nonsense.
My comments are pretty clear and consistent imo. You’re the one who admits they’re deliberately ignoring the actual meaning out of some weird personal spite.
If you insist that’s the case instead of being a Zionist trying to shut down critics I’ll believe you.
I’m more than happy to say that the genocide Israel is currently committing is far, far worse than anything any other country that anyone in this thread has mentioned.
But it’s also just more whataboutism on top of whataboutism. One country being equally bad, or even worse, does not excuse the behaviour of another. And bringing it up in a thread aimed at calling out one country serves no purpose other than to try and distract from its atrocities.
You’re really hammering home that you’re only offended by criticism of China and Russia. Gotta admit, disappointing to see you’re a tankie.
I’m not. You had a bad take and are too proud to admit it… Or that you’re being a hypocrite.
I upvoted this meme, as it happens, because it doesn’t try to whattaboutism imperialism. Unlike the other one.
I have zero issue with my criticism of China and Russia. There is nothing else for me to admit.
You need to stop trying to distort it and pretending it’s support for Israels genocide. It’s a disgusting tactic, the same employed by Zionists in labeling everything critical of them as antisemitic.
🤷♂️
This could have been a great moment with such a blatant moment of dissonance for introspection and interrogating your own biases, but some people can’t admit that to themselves.
Unlike me, obviously.
Unless, of course, I’m just giving you too much credit in the first place and your worldview stops at “China bad” with absolutely no consideration that you’re engaging in the same flaw in thought as a tankie’s “America bad”
Yes some people cannot.
Either way there’s nothing else left to say in regards to you.
Out of ego deflections alreast, huh
Like I said,
🤷♂️
Are you suggesting the Tibeten people weren’t liberated from the slave-owning class? That Mao should have just let the Lamas practice slavery forever?
No, OP is probably referring to the invasion as a whole, as well as the genocide and cultural/social repression carried out by the Chinese government on Tibet during its ongoing occupation of the country.
You can free slaves without needing to annex the region. Claiming an independent country for your own government to control permanently (regardless of supposed initial intent) is called imperialism.
The kidnapping of a child for the purposes of destroying/controlling the religion of a culture you conquered definitely is imperialism.
As is the shelling of civilian populations to quell protests, shelling major sacred monasteries / cultural heritage sites, imprisonment and torture of women during women’s uprising, installing your own government controlled head of a religion because the original one said bad things against your imperialist government etc.
Those are probably what OP is referring to when they mean the PRC acted imperialist when it used ”military interventions, and cultural influence to maintain their dominance over other nations” like Tibet.
^ that quoted section is from the ProleWiki page for Imperialism btw, so even by the communist/socialist definition of imperialism, the occupation of Tibet by the PRC was/is imperialist
You can free slaves without needing to annex the region. Claiming an independent country for your own government to control permanently (regardless of supposed initial intent) is called imperialism.
Tibet wasn’t an “independent country,” it was one of countless warlord states that emerged following the fall of the Qing. Both the CCP and the KMT recognized the need to pacify these states and reunify the country, so much so that they were both willing to put aside ideological differences and form a temporary alliance in order to do it. Tibet was always part of China, is still claimed by Taiwan, and never received international recognition as an independent country, just from like, Mongolia and one or two other countries.
If you want to treat Tibet as an independent country, then should we also treat all the other warlord states that were put down by the united front the same way? Should we just say that whoever has de facto control of a region is the rightful owner of it - even if it’s a theocracy with a brutal system of serfdom?
the original one said bad things against your imperialist government
The original one was a slave owner wtf
I don’t have a very strong opinion on Tibet as I haven’t been there and investigated, but anyone defending the Lamas China drove out knows even less and is just trying to twist anything at all into hostile evidence.
The Dalai Lama currently in exile assumed his political power at age 15 AFTER the PRC invaded. So unless the PRC didn’t end feudalism in 1950 like they say they did (and also assuming the slavery actually happened the way the PRC said it did despite others claiming it is mostly just PRC propaganda used to try and legitimize their invasion) I don’t think you can really call him a slave owner.
Regardless, the only one trying to twist things seems to be you because once again, you are trying to draw attention away from the main argument which is that the PRCs actions were imperialist.
Even if the slave owner claim was correct, that wouldn’t negate the other events and imperialist actions I listed. However, because you can’t refute those claims you instead chose to default to ad hominem, trying to attack me or my reliability rather than the evidence I listed.
are you suggesting that if you do something nice for someone once, you own them forever?
I am saying you are mischaracterizing the relationship; Tibet is a part of China and her people are democratically represented as such.
must suck to be a chinese shill…
hey, how do you feel about the 1989 Tiananmen Square protests and massacre?
was china just keeping everyone happy by crushing their heads with tanks?
When you find yourself defending literal slave owners maybe take a step back and reevaluate how you got here.
I don’t defend slave owners, but you do defend genocide. I’ll pass on taking any life from advice from someone like that.
How about China free the liberated Tibet? Oh, what’s that it was really about territorial acquisition?
I know I’m late to the party but you’re arguing with a known tankie. I would suggest block and move on. No need to read pure propaganda and lies.
Tibet is free, they have representation and everything.
I do not defend genocide because there is no genocide happening right here in Xinjiang, you just refuse to believe you’ve been lied to. No investigation, no right to speak.
Tibet is not an independent country.
Neither is Ohio, what’s your point?
You know I haven’t personally seen ICE in my city; I guess that means there is no genocide or imperialism happening here either. Guess America isn’t imperialist after all lol
Thanks to your comment I just realized tankies are basically MAGA overseas. Both share love of dictatorships and are ultranationalists who fall heavy into the cult of personality, and also drink the koolaid just as hard as MAGA do about what the dear leader and party tells them to believe.
Chinese consoomers so progressive!
By that logic, why hasn’t the US freed the confederacy?
Nobody is arguing that the USA isn’t imperialist.
Right, which begs two questions…
Why all the smoke for China when it’s obvious the US is much more so?
Do you think it would be better if we allowed the confederacy to exist? You deflected to “both sides”. What do you believe here?
You deflected to “both sides”.
lol what? You were the one who initiated the whataboutism here.
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I think you mean “raises the question”.
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It’s not obvious that all the smoke is for China. We get so much American politics on Lemmy that everyone else is sick of it and sets up filters. This meme in particular is about China.
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No. I think if it wasn’t imperialist, the USA would’ve done a better job at Reconstruction. In case you need an obligatory condemnation, the USA has the world’s largest prison population and still practices slavery.
There are other countries that are neither imperialist nor slavers.
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those two can go together
