Fun fact, we evolved to eat raw meat, that’s why we have an appendix. Then, when we stopped eating raw meat, we started to evolve away from the appendix.
Evolutionary arguments don’t support the naturalist fallacy, because evolution doesn’t work like that. It responds to environmental pressures. It’s not some guiding light for what we’re “meant” to be doing, it’s the tools we’ve got to support what we already did.
For our ancestors, the appendix most likely evolved to help them digest a diet rich in raw vegetables and cellulose, as it still does in many herbivorous mammals. Thousands of years ago it would have functioned as an extension of the cecum, involved in the bacterial digestion of fibrous plant materials.
That is not proven though, the appendix part, that’s the explanation I like the best as well. Other explanations, I forget, the aliens had it for some shit we don’t even know about, oh yeah, the more likely non joke one, and it could be what you say and this both many organs do multiple things, is to provide a reservoir of gut bacteria, to repopulate the gut after the system is flushed. That would go right along with digesting raw meat, as using independent bacteria is large part of the human body we’ve come to learn.
I forget what the other theories are, but there are others for the appendix, I believe the raw meat and reservoir of bacteria both though is most likely.
While still technically a theory, the appendix acting as a reservoir for healthy gut bacteria has largely been proven. That function could very well have helped with digestion of raw meat as well, especially if eating raw meats caused issues with diarrhea.
It’s probably got more to do with eating less rotten meat than eating less raw meat. It has functions for the immune system it is like the surveillance system for what is being introduced to the body.
They are still omnivores who choose to limit their diet. Acknowledging that is a choice gives it meaning, which would be lost if it was treated as something similar to being an herbivore.
I am not personally a vegan or vegetarian, but respect the choice to limit one’s diet for the purpose of limiting animal suffering.
that’s a choice by an individual. doesn’t change how their body behaves due to millions of years of evolution.
ironically, the thing that gave them the ability to make the choice to be vegan is the thing they are rebelling against. high volumes of protein, specifically those from consuming the brains and muscle of prey, allowed the species to grow larger and more complex brains.
in a few million years vegans are going to be too stupid to make the choice for themselves and will return to consuming meat because they’re omnivorous.
By your logic, obligate carnivores would have the larger brains. Humans are obligate omnivores. Studies show no significant differences in cognitive function, cardiovascular risk, or bone health when vegan diets meet recommended dietary allowance levels. Animal protein contributed during the evolution of the human brain, but the development was driven by cooking. Cooking externalized the energy required for digesting food, which allowed for a reduction of jaws/jaw muscles, and especially gut size, freeing energy that could be used by the brain instead.
Also, the brain is fueled by glucose, not protein …
It’s interesting how you seem to believe your stance is based on science and facts yet you conducted no research to find out what vegans actually eat. Else you’d have found out vegans do typically eat a lot of protein and generally have healthier diets than the general public. The reason being vegans by definition spend time thinking about what to eat and looking stuff up, whereas many people just eat whatever.
I’m an omnivore, but god, imagine being so fragile that even talking to someone about veganism without resorting to #MEATPOSTING when your comfort food is a drive through away…
Imagine having an ego so fragile that pointing out misused terminology turns into a flamebate where the person feels personally attacked.
I couldn’t care less about vegan or vegetarian lifestyles and the people who follow it. it’s a personal preference like sucking dick or being a Jets fan. but personal preferences don’t change biology.
stick a devout vegan on a liferaft with only fish to eat and they will eat fish. that is, unless they have magically evolved out the will to survive.
your meatposting gave me a good chuckle and reminded me of cannibal holocaust.
There’s no evidence to support that. Best evidence is that our ancestors for the longest time were likely opportunistic omnivores. Plants of course were a large part of the diet, but looking back to about 3.9 mya meat was on the menu.
They overwhelmingly ate more plants than meat we can safely presume. Meat they could get would be mostly insects, and an already dead or sick animals. Later when they came out of the trees shellfish.
Yes scavenging for meat is generally considered a very important part of human evolution. Our stomachs are particularly acidic when compared to other great apes. This is believed to have evolved due to a high consumption of scavenged meats.
You are right though plants generally did form a large portion of our and our ancestors diets.
Important to note that as our brain size increased it did correlate with increased meat consumption as well. This all goes into calorie densities, available nutrients, and evolutionary pressures.
What a curious phrase. Not just for the substitution of vegetarian for vegan, but for the use of “more”. More vegan. I thought it was binary. Are there partial vegans? I thought that wasn’t allowed.
Because my diet includes more calories and nutrition from plant matter than meat most days, am I more vegan now?
Its more fun to highlight that veganism is about ethics so its not dietary its about ethical consumption of animal products. Which humans are animals.
And you could be a carnivore vegan - all you’d have to do is find volunteer meat to eat, so you’d need to be a cannibal or find that talking cow from the Douglas Adams books.
Outside of mother’s milk our ape ancestors weren’t getting any dairy though. Maybe the last 10k, even longer, years. Not the last 100k, to say nothing of the last 10 million.
You are right it is a newer adaptation, but one that was clearly advantageous to our species. There are not many evolutionary changes that occurred independently in 3-5 different populations.
Evolution is on a long scale, we have a lot longer as vegans than we do eating any meat to speak of outside insects and scavenging. Only a blink of an eye hunting our own meat to a large extent, a small fraction of a million years, compared to millions, and tens of millions, vegan ish.
Longer when you include like passive meat eating, like shellfish, which is what people were thought to be following as they colonized the middle east and asia.
if your argument is that we were herbivores longer than omnivores I’ve got some news for you. we ate planktons for alot longer than plants, mostly because plants didn’t even exist for millions of years.
so by your logic we should be eating phytoplanktons instead of plants and animals.
you can’t just dismiss millions of years of evolution on a whim based entirely on an emotional reaction.
be vegan all you want, but it doesn’t change the fact that you are an omnivore.
Veganism is unnatural because we’re all omnivores, and evolved eating both plants and animals.
Impregnating cows this way is also unnatural.
Both can be true.
Definitely. Aren’t their hands in the anus?
Vegans will NEVER have the political clout to force their way of life on everyone, and they’re mad AF about it.
FAFO
This isn’t about veganism, no?
Uh, the guy in your link wasn’t fucking around though, he got lynched by an angry mob but did nothing wrong.
It’s not just political clout. Attempting to politically force veganism on the world would result in a war, not just votes against it.
Fun fact, we evolved to eat raw meat, that’s why we have an appendix. Then, when we stopped eating raw meat, we started to evolve away from the appendix.
Evolutionary arguments don’t support the naturalist fallacy, because evolution doesn’t work like that. It responds to environmental pressures. It’s not some guiding light for what we’re “meant” to be doing, it’s the tools we’ve got to support what we already did.
This article says it was for raw vegetables:
That is not proven though, the appendix part, that’s the explanation I like the best as well. Other explanations, I forget, the aliens had it for some shit we don’t even know about, oh yeah, the more likely non joke one, and it could be what you say and this both many organs do multiple things, is to provide a reservoir of gut bacteria, to repopulate the gut after the system is flushed. That would go right along with digesting raw meat, as using independent bacteria is large part of the human body we’ve come to learn.
I forget what the other theories are, but there are others for the appendix, I believe the raw meat and reservoir of bacteria both though is most likely.
While still technically a theory, the appendix acting as a reservoir for healthy gut bacteria has largely been proven. That function could very well have helped with digestion of raw meat as well, especially if eating raw meats caused issues with diarrhea.
It’s probably got more to do with eating less rotten meat than eating less raw meat. It has functions for the immune system it is like the surveillance system for what is being introduced to the body.
To quote Meatloaf: 🎵🎶 IIIIIIIIIIII WANT MY
MONEYAPPENDIX BACK!🎶🎵Look. If you want it to scan, it’s got to be "‘ppendix’, otherwise there’s an extra syllable there. :)
Except, you know, the vegans.
They are still omnivores who choose to limit their diet. Acknowledging that is a choice gives it meaning, which would be lost if it was treated as something similar to being an herbivore.
I am not personally a vegan or vegetarian, but respect the choice to limit one’s diet for the purpose of limiting animal suffering.
that’s a choice by an individual. doesn’t change how their body behaves due to millions of years of evolution.
ironically, the thing that gave them the ability to make the choice to be vegan is the thing they are rebelling against. high volumes of protein, specifically those from consuming the brains and muscle of prey, allowed the species to grow larger and more complex brains.
in a few million years vegans are going to be too stupid to make the choice for themselves and will return to consuming meat because they’re omnivorous.
By your logic, obligate carnivores would have the larger brains. Humans are obligate omnivores. Studies show no significant differences in cognitive function, cardiovascular risk, or bone health when vegan diets meet recommended dietary allowance levels. Animal protein contributed during the evolution of the human brain, but the development was driven by cooking. Cooking externalized the energy required for digesting food, which allowed for a reduction of jaws/jaw muscles, and especially gut size, freeing energy that could be used by the brain instead.
Also, the brain is fueled by glucose, not protein …
Video of me after I found an actually good vegan wing place
good vegan food is hard to find. anything I’ve ate almost always has to be made at home.
It’s interesting how you seem to believe your stance is based on science and facts yet you conducted no research to find out what vegans actually eat. Else you’d have found out vegans do typically eat a lot of protein and generally have healthier diets than the general public. The reason being vegans by definition spend time thinking about what to eat and looking stuff up, whereas many people just eat whatever.
I’m an omnivore, but god, imagine being so fragile that even talking to someone about veganism without resorting to #MEATPOSTING when your comfort food is a drive through away…
Imagine having an ego so fragile that pointing out misused terminology turns into a flamebate where the person feels personally attacked.
I couldn’t care less about vegan or vegetarian lifestyles and the people who follow it. it’s a personal preference like sucking dick or being a Jets fan. but personal preferences don’t change biology.
stick a devout vegan on a liferaft with only fish to eat and they will eat fish. that is, unless they have magically evolved out the will to survive.
your meatposting gave me a good chuckle and reminded me of cannibal holocaust.
am I meatposting right?
Never stop posting comrade, it shows you in your best light.
Our monkey, or rather ape, ancestors were more vegan than meat eater.
Today, most people are “more vegan” than meat eater, too, as in they eat more grains and vegetables than meat. If that’s what you meant.
Not if rfk and the beef lobby have anything to say about that
There’s no evidence to support that. Best evidence is that our ancestors for the longest time were likely opportunistic omnivores. Plants of course were a large part of the diet, but looking back to about 3.9 mya meat was on the menu.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australopithecus_afarensis
They overwhelmingly ate more plants than meat we can safely presume. Meat they could get would be mostly insects, and an already dead or sick animals. Later when they came out of the trees shellfish.
Yes scavenging for meat is generally considered a very important part of human evolution. Our stomachs are particularly acidic when compared to other great apes. This is believed to have evolved due to a high consumption of scavenged meats.
You are right though plants generally did form a large portion of our and our ancestors diets.
Important to note that as our brain size increased it did correlate with increased meat consumption as well. This all goes into calorie densities, available nutrients, and evolutionary pressures.
What a curious phrase. Not just for the substitution of vegetarian for vegan, but for the use of “more”. More vegan. I thought it was binary. Are there partial vegans? I thought that wasn’t allowed.
Because my diet includes more calories and nutrition from plant matter than meat most days, am I more vegan now?
Its more fun to highlight that veganism is about ethics so its not dietary its about ethical consumption of animal products. Which humans are animals.
And you could be a carnivore vegan - all you’d have to do is find volunteer meat to eat, so you’d need to be a cannibal or find that talking cow from the Douglas Adams books.
And I’m sorry but why add the fucking picture I don’t get how that is applicable to anything
I was going to add a picture of Epstein and his super pals from a mural in sydney but I don’t even see how to do that.
The picture is of “the vegan police” from Scott pilgrim vs the world (2010)
In prehistory the are not eating dairy, but may eat dead animals, insects, shellfish, etc.
So not all vegan, but moreso than not.
Humans evolved to proccess dairy, not once, not twice, but 3 times. Some studies even suggest up to 5 times.
Seems like it was definitely advantageous to consume dairy
Outside of mother’s milk our ape ancestors weren’t getting any dairy though. Maybe the last 10k, even longer, years. Not the last 100k, to say nothing of the last 10 million.
You are right it is a newer adaptation, but one that was clearly advantageous to our species. There are not many evolutionary changes that occurred independently in 3-5 different populations.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lactase_persistence
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3048992/#%3A~%3Atext=Lactase+is+the+enzyme+responsible%2Ctrait+known+as+lactase+persistence.
that’s like comparing us to the primordial plankton that use to eat microbes.
it’s just really stupid.
let’s ignore 25 million years of evolution.
Pandas would like to have a word wich yu
Evolution is on a long scale, we have a lot longer as vegans than we do eating any meat to speak of outside insects and scavenging. Only a blink of an eye hunting our own meat to a large extent, a small fraction of a million years, compared to millions, and tens of millions, vegan ish.
Longer when you include like passive meat eating, like shellfish, which is what people were thought to be following as they colonized the middle east and asia.
“outside insects and scavenging”
So, scavenger and omnivore… never vegan
I guess you are right.
if your argument is that we were herbivores longer than omnivores I’ve got some news for you. we ate planktons for alot longer than plants, mostly because plants didn’t even exist for millions of years.
so by your logic we should be eating phytoplanktons instead of plants and animals.
you can’t just dismiss millions of years of evolution on a whim based entirely on an emotional reaction.
be vegan all you want, but it doesn’t change the fact that you are an omnivore.
Not millions though, tens of thousands eating meat, millions eating mostly vegan. I’m not a vegan btw don’t have a dog in this fight.
“mostly vegan” meaning “omnivore”.