(laughs in linux)
good luck with that
If it worked out, the idle Windows 11 RAM usage would’ve been around 4.8GB
Me on beefy Linux distro with a metric ton of garbage installed: 3.2GB
Good luck vibe coding memory efficiency…
is it even possible to vibe code efficient memory use properly?
Possible? Yes. Likely? No.
ok. is it even remotely more cost-effective than doing the old-fashioned optimizing?
Probably not but maybe. It’s a gamble that I’m guessing most MBAs would love to make!
i guess a better way is just make something less RAM heavy from the get go.
Good luck with that if it’s being vibe coded.
i don’t think vibe coding will be that sophisticated any time soon.
Copilot. Make no mistakes and be efficient with memory usage.
Hahahahahah
You no want 6GB LLM running as a system service???
Our Microslop overlords have said that I do, so I guess I do? I don’t know. Hand on. I’m asking Copi— I mean… I’m thinking…
You could download more RAM by buying Copilot cloud subscription!
Now there’s an idea!
16GB RAM. ~3500 packages building up a nightmarish franken-debian of like ~250ish apps. 1.5GB RAM usage on boot. optimisation really does wonders
edit: yes, true story btw
Maybe they should try not writing OS code in react. Perhaps they should consider dedicating as many resources to cleaning up code as they do to adding “features.”
Maybe they should make a really new windows version and not a mix from 7,8,10 patched together… with all the problems carried + AI coding making things worse.
They still haven’t been able to replicate functionality in settings compared to control panel. Going from scratch is just gonna get us the rumored win 12 that’s only ai
Well, when i said new OS, I was not meaning AI slop from scratch.
Since NT 4.0 it’s just bloat. They never rewrote the whole codebase. It makes sense for backwards compatibility but falls apart when you’re installing a driver via 30 years old GUI.
Just tell your AI agents to reduce the RAM usage and install size by 20% and let them rip. How hard can it be?
Simple, NoPilot can just erase all your files. Binaries can’t take up memory of they can’t be loaded.
More like tell your users to only run services in the cloud and not to run anything on their own computers.
Instructions unclear, now
ChromeEdge webview is running every cloud application as a separate electron processOh they’re getting there alright….
Tell AI to download more RAM
I figure that was the prompt that caused this “bug”
Microslop?
All at a time where I think I’m actually going to switch to Linux.
I just tried out an install on my laptop and boy does it work well even for gaming.
Windows has, nothing I actually need any more?
It feels really big to really leave Windows for good, but, I think it’s going to happen after a bit more testing of my Linux setup.
I told myself I’d give Win11 (using tools to uninstall all the bullshit/tracking) for 3-4 months before seriously considering linux. I made it 3 months, got tired of having to re-uninstall shit I don’t want every update and just flat out wiped the install and installed CachyOS. It’s been perfect, even new game releases like Death Stranding 2 worked out of the box, fuck windows.
Aww yeah love to hear these stories!
Oohh, Bazzite?
Bazzite 🥰
Was it plug and play (relatively) for you? After benchmarking a few games I noticed Bazzite came with a 40% CPU performance reduction compared to w11.
This is why its been announced now. With all the tracking Microsoft has in W11, including being able to track usage to an email account for most, they will have a good idea who has binned windows and who hasn’t.
Its this volume of switching that has them worried enough to actually pretend to fix things. I say pretend as its fairly obvious what they need to remove to reduce the bloat on RAM but their business it tied to it now, like concrete over boots on a mafia snitch.
I have a back up SSD with windows on I swap out to play the very few games that still require it that I just can’t give up. But I don’t have the need to duel boot anymore. I just keep the SSD to scratch my itch
I’m curious what games do you use that still need windows?
Apex legends… I know, I know
Games with intrusive anticheat like Battlefield 6 Rainbow Six, League of Legends ect. You need to check protondb website if games you play run on Linux before you make the jump
Right now I have a console to play those games, but don’t know what I’ll do when the next “generation” comes out.
Next Gen will likely be very expensive due do very high RAM prices. IMO current consoles will run for at least few more years.
Honestly, I don’t even think hardware has progressed enough to warrant a new generation. It doesn’t feel like much even uses the current consoles to the full extent.
Linux has some retarded behaviors, but it got so much better in the last 5 years, that decent distros like Fedora KDE are getting good enough as replacement
You say this as if you have been waiting for it?
You, and I both, know they are going to ask Copilot “What can we eliminate in the code base”.
Don’t use bazzite. Use Mint. Go for the easiest solution. You can get another drive and dual boot later.
Amateurs. On my personal pc, windows RAM usage is exactly 0.
I wish windows went down a different path. Instead they decided to double down on ads and ai, because shareholders are more important than the actual customers
Their real customers don’t see the ads with Windows 11 Enterprise and AI is controllable with Intune and GPO. You’re not the primary customer.
Suckers keep using it, so what incentive is there for them to deslopify?
I’d personally rather use a Chromebook than Windows.
The thing is that there are real measurements of the market share of windows dropping. The only reason why adoption of w11 overtook w10 user size is because they made w10 end of life (although there are still ways around)
Unfortunately, some business idiot mathed up that losing users is fine as long as the others get forced onto w11
Windows could have done so much differently. More seamless integration with xbox and cross platform for gaming. Different, easily swappable profiles (windows) for different tasks (basically overhauling desktops, like for art, dev work, etc). Optimizing microsofts enterprise software suite without all the bloat. Not deprecating the idea of android support.
But like all big tech companies, they only see money now
Windows could have done so much differently. More seamless integration with xbox and cross platform for gaming. Different, easily swappable profiles (windows) for different tasks (basically overhauling desktops, like for art, dev work, etc). Optimizing microsofts enterprise software suite without all the bloat. Not deprecating the idea of android support.
But like all big tech companies, they only see money now
People like to hate on Ballmer but all of these ideas came out during his time. Since Satya replaced him, Windows has just been getting worse and worse and the focus on their products have been lost to the cloud and AI. Sure the stock price rose but there’s nothing exciting about Microslop anymore.
If it worked out, the idle Windows 11 RAM usage would’ve been around 4.8GB
That’s still a lot
Considering 8GB systems are back in vogue, that’s a fuckload. More than half your ram just going to the computer existing.
Well no, its doing more than just existing, its sending screen shots of your screen to Microsoft, displaying ads, updating advertising ID to allow them to track you across the web, uploading your typing history It all helps shareholders of microslop.
Last time I booted up Windows 10 it was using around 2.4GB at idle
So Windows 12’s RAM requirement is on track to being almost 10GB unless they cut it back by 20%?
Ironically the install ISO actually went up in size from roughly 5.5GB to 7.5GB in the recent months.
I was about to bring this up. If they just removed all of the slop they implemented in the past 6 months, they could hit that 20% real easy.
All that tracking software is bloated.
Agreed but also have you tried to write a feature with LLMs? It will occasionally just add extra files that do the same thing as one library you already have.
You can even catch it and it will be like oh your right then continue without deleting, so next prompt it decides to use its own library again.
The trick is to tell it what to do and how to do it, not just talk to it like it knows what it’s doing.
People get upset when it can’t complete features based on high level descriptions. They were told it could, after all. “Build be a website that…” However, that will always lead to disaster.
Even then, it’s going to make some batshit decisions on stuff you don’t specify and probably screw up some that you did, and much of it will cause subtle issues.
Remember that even with all the shit they add on to it, it’s still based on a text predictor, not some kind of problem solving or programming engine.
So you go from a legit Developer using their skills refining them day by day to a middle manager who’s just checking the work of the AI workers.
This is the direction of things. On one hand, I’m not a full time developer anymore—after 23 years in the industry. On the other hand, I complete projects 100x faster and have more time for my cat.
But you as someone with the experience can spot the issues and problems when using the tool. That’s because of years of experience, all these newbies are going to be fucked without that experience.
Agreed 100%. There is going to be a problem in the future where people like me are, well, dead. And junior developers never got the hands on experience to learn what I (should) know after so many years.
But, for now, I have to eat. And I no longer care to give my mental health to a project I am not getting an equal share of. So, I am very much enjoying what I can get done.
Humorously, even with near-unlimited power at my fingertips, I still struggle to find any personal projects worth doing. I’ve made a few arcade style phone games and some desktop apps for myself, which are all very nice. But AI cannot write a compelling game story, or design consistent artwork without significant head banging. Sure it can get the ball rolling, but there is always something hollow about it.
Windows 11 is not based on a single unified UI framework. Instead, it uses a mix of legacy Win32 components, UWP elements, modern WinUI layers, and web-based technologies like WebView2 and React.
I am reading this as MMC snap-ins and control panel. There is no other alternative to manage these settings outside of PowerShell.
Also, what idiot decided that only one settings window is allowed open at one time? Sometimes I would like to be in Windows update, power settings, Ethernet settings, and printer settings all at once.
I hate how the settings app is taking over control panel entries to make them worse and show me the original control panel window after going down 3 levels because the stupid fucks can’t design UI for shit.
Thankfully, you can still get to a lot of them if you know the name of the control panel applet.
Want to see the advanced settings for a network adapter?
Good luck finding it, fucko
Ncpa.cpl > right click > properties and go from there is my main method.
Otherwise, Win+X > G (devmgmt.msc) and look at the network adapter in device manager
Other than the win+x chord, that works on just about every version I have to touch
Oh I solved the issue by switching to Linux years ago lol. I just recently had this frustration happen at work
Heh, I’m a windows sysadmin, so I use them often enough to know it from memory. I’m almost entirely Linux at home these days as well
Fighting with their shitty “new” UI trying to find the old Sound UI to fix an issue that their new UI doesn’t even have a toggle for really chapped my ass.
This bullshit right here is what finally pushed me over the edge and into the warm embrace of a penguin.
IKR? I spent multiple hours looking for GPU switching whitelist because some moron in MS put it under “Display” instead of GPU settings or Power Management
Apparently there’s a ton of CBT involved in doing anything in the new Settings app, so it makes sense to only bring over the things you absolutely have to and then send people to the old control panel for the rest.
Computer based training? Cognitive behavior therapy? Cock and ball torture?
Cock and ball torture?
That’s probably UX designers fetish
That last one.
Like windows 2000 to XP or Vista to 7… 10 to 11
The eternal enshitification…
Windows 7 was IMO decent. Didn’t deviate too much from the old one, and you could still reconfigure it to have same UI style as Windows XP.
Now if you want similar UI get yourself Linux with KDE desktop
Vista to 7
enshitification
Lol, lmao even
7 was better than vista in just about every way.
That’s the thing… 7 is Vista. Just with a new UI.
Windows 2000 is XP. XP just has a new interface. 7 and XP are for consumers. 2000 and Vista are more like server editions (even the pro versions.)
Vista has Aero but also the classic server(windows NT/2000) UI. Even modern server versions have essentially the same classic control panels. And server versions don’t have all the extra bullshit(7 wasn’t so bad yet, but 10 and 11 are). That’s why I prefer to run Windows server as my desktop.
What made Vista/7 great were the under the hood(kernel) improvements, particularly to the threading model. They made safe handling non-negotiable. This retroactively fixed countless programs and improved overall system stability significantly.
There’s really no other major differences between Vista and 7 besides aesthetics(the shell.)
Right, but none of that is enshitification or contradicts that 7 was an improvement over vista in most every way. As you stated, there were numerous kernel improvements going to 7, as well as improvements on locking logic, memory access and (let’s not ignore the most obvious) driver support. The two operating systems were very similar, but saying there are no major differences other than aesthetic is not accurate. There were less major differences than xp > vista or 7 > 8, but it was a bit more than just aesthetics.
Also, fuck Server 2016. All my homies hate Server 2016…
Win98 good
Windows ME bad
WindowsXP good
Vista bad
Win7 good (maybe peak)
Win8 bad
Win10 OK?
Win11 bad
I’ve heard Windows ME bad, but I’ve almost never heard someone call Windows 2000 bad
Yeah I was meaning ME (too late too tired). Edited.
In an OS literally named "Windows " lol
Macrohard Window
MacroHard Doors. When one door closes, you’re locked in. Why? Cause fuck you, that’s why.
They decided it because there are so many duplicate Settings pages controlling the same thing.
There are over 12 different places to change USB power save settings
Easily propagated with windows messaging apis.
That requires work for every single page.
They clearly would rather not
Insert XKCD one more standard.
I’m all for revamping controls, but don’t make crappier less effective ones.
Also, what idiot decided that only one settings window is allowed open at one time?
Microsoft engineers were worried that people missed the joys of MS-DOS and having only one application running at once. Next up, will be the return of base memory versus expanded memory versus extended memory. This ends when they devolve Windows to prove Bill Gates right that 640kB should be enough memory for anyone.
I’ve got my autoexec.bat and config.sys ready to go.
what idiot decided that only one settings window is allowed open at one time?
Microsoft’s army of macbook-using UI “designers” who have to justify their salary so they make up shit nobody wants
There’s some very aggressive autocorrect programs that seem to be bloating all their current software. They should start with taking those out.
Obvious course of events considering how the commodity PC market is essentially cut off from RAM supply for an indeterminate number of years with no respite in sight. Memory isn’t cheap anymore, and if they kept making Windows 11 as they used to it won’t be long before PCs in the market are simply left unable to run the OS at all.
They already know that the solution exists in their Windows for Legacy PCs but they don’t care about it and will waste their time and money going in a loop.
That is why they needed outside help to get Windows for Legacy PCs to hit their memory target
Windows for Legacy PCs
Low-margin product with no feasible return over the costs it takes to build and maintain. Windows 11 meanwhile is the main advertising and cross-selling platform for Microsoft’s high-margin cloud and AI products. Little wonder they prefer one over the other.
They have no choice but to do so in order to increase the user number of Windows 11. Since RAM prices are high, users will only be able to afford low-spec RAM once support for Windows 10 ends. Otherwise, they would not upgrade to Windows 11, but would instead switch to Linux or Mac, or stick with Windows 10.
they would not upgrade to Windows 11, but would instead switch to Linux or Mac
Absolute win.
It worked well with just 64MB of RAM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Fundamentals_for_Legacy_PCs
So they easily can get the memory footprint down to the floor
A thin client? Sure, you can get it down that far if you don’t want to run anything but the remote desktop software.
